Banners Broker Scam Update
After refer your post I take in why banner broker site got huge scammed. In any case, investors properly understand…
UPDATE 28/2/2013: Just days ago, BannersBroker announced the reopening of their Indian office in Goa after ‘the conclusion of a police investigation’. Once again, they have been caught lying. Click here to read the full court order, which explicitly states that the company’s accounts are frozen, and their assets remain in police custody.
UPDATE 29/1/2013: I have just posted a full Q&A session with Terry Stern, the International Public Relations Director representing Banners Broker.
BREAKING NEWS 31/12: Banners Broker’s Goa office has been raided and shut down by the police. The company has been charged under IPC section 4, 5 and 6 of the PCMC (banning) act 1978, 406 and 420. Full announcement here.
UPDATE 4/1: Amid growing speculation over the future of Banners Broker India, CEO Chris Smith has cancelled the company’s ‘World Tour’ that was originally planned to reach Kolkata in February. Smith insisted that Banners Broker is ‘fine’ during his Friday conference call. He blamed ‘a little mischief’ from an ex-employee for the criminal charges brought against the company. The investigation is still ongoing, and the Banners Broker Goan office remains closed. More information here.
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In October, I made a post about Banners Broker being a suspected ponzi scheme. To say that the post has gone viral would be a massive understatement. It is currently drawing several thousand hits per day, with 357 comments and counting.
My Hate Mail has also been buzzing left, right and center.
While that initial post was designed to raise awareness of the scam, critics have said – quite rightly – that it doesn’t offer enough evidence to say, beyond any shadow of a doubt, that the program is a ponzi scheme.
Personally, I wasn’t expecting there to even be a debate. It’s pretty obvious what Banners Broker is.
But perhaps I am guilty of overlooking the fact that most people who invest in Banners Broker have no exposure to the real online advertising industry. It is not so obvious without that first-hand experience.
I’ve decided to release this second post to provide a more cohesive look at why Banners Broker stinks, and how we can make such assumptions about it being a ponzi scheme without a single piece of ‘definitive’ proof.
If you haven’t read the first Banners Broker Scam article, I suggest you start there.
Banners Broker in the Media
Before I get in to the evidence and lies, I want to address a common misconception that it is only small-time bloggers who are posting negatively about Banners Broker.
The BB apologists seem intent on tarring us all as sad-acts who have nothing better to do than watch and wait for a good thing’s demise.
I prefer to call it an investment in the public interest. Many people are going to be harmed by the collapse of Banners Broker, and it is not just bloggers who are taking notice.
The Irish media has devoured the fanciful business model after leaders Rajiv Dixit, Chris Smith and co rolled in to town for a gala last month.
Here’s some of the press coverage:
The next time Banners Broker tells you that the negative criticism comes from ‘bloggers with hate agendas’, feel free to ask whether they consider the Sunday World (a major Irish red-top with over 1 million readers per week) in that same category.
The History of Banners Broker
The Banners Broker you see before you today, the alleged worldwide advertising force, is quite a radical leap from the Banners Broker that was announced to the HYIP scene in 2010. Here’s Kul Josun explaining the origins of the program in a very old and very revealing video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1e5KGw87QI
“Banners Broker: Welcome to the worlds first cycler doubler, where you can double your money without signing up one person. Join for free and change your future today.”
To all the commenters in the last post who asked for a definitive piece of evidence that Banners Broker is a ponzi scam, this might as well be it. Upon launching, they branded themselves to the notorious HYIP community as the world’s first ‘straightline’ cycler doubler.
What this means is that your payouts come from within the system (cycled) directly from sign-ups below you (a straight line).
Here’s a fun task for you:
Go to Google, and search “straightline cycler doubler“.
Here you will find a revealing look in to the world of Banners Broker before the modern narrative of an online advertising network.
Look at the early press releases, look at the very first forum posts, look at the YouTube videos. Tell me it doesn’t stink.
Now tell me why this company should be considered in the same breath as real online ad companies.
Why did Banners Broker brand themselves as a moneymaking system to the HYIP community when the nature of their alleged business model (if it were true) would be more fitting on TechCrunch?
“Banners Broker Uncovers Industry Shaking Algorithm; Banner Ads Never to be the Same Again!” (Yeah, I never saw that headline either.)
The answer is because Banners Broker’s roots are tied to the shadiest realms of HYIP. Recycled cash is the real source of their revenues, not an industry-changing algorithm in the online advertising space. And that’s why Banners Broker pitched their company directly to the kind of individuals who would be looking to invest in it: amateur investors a few small worlds away from Silicon Valley.
To put it simply: they know the hand that feeds them.
And it is not advertisers.
My favourite part of this video is Kul laying the smack down on other HYIP programs, “The hype and maths don’t work. Period.” And yet, he brags…
Seems like a legitimate online advertising company!
Seriously people, these opportunities do not exist legally. Not in this world or the next.
Anybody who tries to convince you of such BS should be red-flagged and banished from business conversation for the rest of his days.
Before you invest in the next get-rich-quick program (or Banners Broker if you are new to the idea), consider that the world’s greatest investor – Warren Buffett – has written his name in to history by producing an average annual return of just over 20%. A staggering feat in the investment arena.
Now ask why Warren Buffett isn’t investing in the ‘stock’ of Banners Broker panels, a program that the apologists claim can deliver an upwards annual return of 300%.
The answer is because Warren Buffett prefers to work with real companies, not smiley faced Primark suits fresh off the back of a ‘World Tour’ lorry.
Chris Smith… The Man, The Myth, the Stock Photo
In the video above, you will notice that it introduces Chris Smith as the mathematical genius behind Banners Broker. Except that isn’t the same Chris Smith who can be found travelling the world today.
In fact, that Chris Smith is a stock photo that can be purchased for £18.00, which was evidently too much for “We Are Cash Rich” Banners Broker as they have cropped it above the watermark:
Small details, guys.
I hate to point out the sheer unprofessionalism of this company by resorting to stock photo CEOs, but it goes a long way to understanding the bigger picture. We are dealing in smoke and mirrors.
Nothing is ever what it seems with Banners Broker.
“In Defence of Banners Broker…”
You may have seen this article, Debunking the Scam, that attempts to explain – in Clickbank sales letter form – ‘how the Banners Broker model works’. It has become the Bible of Cult BB, a source that is supposed to deflect all criticism. There’s just one problem: it’s a steaming pile of you know what…
Let’s look at some of the points raised:
From Debunking the Scam
So the product of Banners Broker is: Advertising Impressions.
The end user – the advertiser, who never sees or hears of Banners Broker, gets ad space that hosts his advertising, and visitors to the various websites where that ad is displayed, see that ad.
There’s the product.
Hold on, hold on. WHAT? This is one of the stupidest defence arguments I’ve ever heard.
The advertiser never sees or hears of Banners Broker?!
That’s a pretty dumb theory considering an advertiser needs to sign up through BannersBroker.com before he can use the advertising system. Or is that just there for show?
The purpose of Banners Broker is to act as the middleman and broker ad impressions. We already know that Banners Broker gains access to publisher websites by brokering through Clicksor as a reseller (see this description).
Note here, “Selling traffic has not been this easy before. Become a Clicksor authorized reseller now and experience the simplicity in selling traffic to your advertisers.”
Clicksor provides the publishers. It’s up to Banners Broker to provide the advertisers, which is the whole god damn point of reselling. The fruitcase above has clearly not understood this when he comes out with tripe such as “the advertiser never sees or hears of Banners Broker“.
I mean, come on dude. Does the following link mean nothing to you?
http://bannersbroker.com/main/advertiser
I suppose the advertiser has to sign up wearing a blindfold then?
Or is – as I somehow suspect – the argument designed to distract our attention from the fact that not a single Banners Broker advertiser is known to exist?
Moving on to his next crazy suggestion…
From Debunking the Scam
Banners Broker is just what it says – a broker in the banner advertising field. A unique broker – unique in that no one else does what they do.
What’s a broker? The dictionary says: “a broker is a person who buys and sells goods or assets for others.”
Banners Broker “brokers” in a slightly different way than has been done before on line… here’s an overview:
There is a network of websites and advertising companies that comprise what is called the “Blind Network”(Click here for definition) (an Internet ad industry term).
Note, that I didn’t say – Banners Broker operates within a Blind Network.
They operate within T-H-E Blind Network.The same Blind Network that millions of advertisers and publishers already operate within.
The same Blind Network that successfully generates BILLIONS of Dollars of revenue every year.
This isn’t something invented by someone to trick you – it’s how the on-line advertising industry works – (so how can these so called “insiders” be inside anything but their own rear ends?)
Let me keep this short and sweet. There is no such thing as ‘THE Blind Network’.
If ‘THE Blind Network’ is real, and Banners Broker operates within ‘THE Blind Network’, who else operates in ‘THE Blind Network’? What is ‘THE Blind Network’?
And if Banners Broker is a pawn in somebody else’s ‘THE Blind Network’, what makes their business model so special that it can’t be replicated by a competitor? Ever heard of the law of competition? Unless Banners Broker took out a patent on banners, we need to have a serious adult discussion.
If we are to believe the margins – eye-watering as they are – why isn’t every single broker in the world rushing to be a part of THE Blind Network?
Answer: There is no such thing.
This idiot then goes on to contradict himself by saying that Banners Broker operates in the same Blind Network as millions of other advertisers and publishers.
So what is its competitive advantage?!
Again, no mention of what this Blind Network actually is, or who runs it… Who needs details, right?
Note on the author: Seriously, who hyphenates “on-line“? Can we really trust that this guy has departed the twentieth century? Maybe the Millenium Bug struck after all.
In a recent development, Banners Broker has debunked any suggestion that it is ‘THE Blind Network’.
The Blind network is NOT created/nor owned by BB, but controlled by 10 other brokers, including Google.
I’m sorry, but this explanation is also a pile of steaming BS. Are we to believe that Banners Broker is brokering ad sales through Google, now? Complete rubbish. Google does not need a company like Banners Broker. It has its own properties to handle publishers and advertisers: AdSense and AdWords. There is no ‘broker’ middleman.
The Choice Network… Now Comes Served With Ads (Or Does It?!)
A key point in my first post on Banners Broker was that the so-called Choice Network was no more than a damp fraudulent squib. The websites in the network clearly belonged to Banners Broker, and none of them had advertisements from legitimate companies.
Well, there must be pigs flying in the sky, because the BB apologists are telling me that the Choice Network is now fully operational, and filled with real ads from real companies.
I took a few minutes to verify their claims, and sure enough, ads from reputable companies are now displaying:
Hold on, though. Before you get excited, we should know better than to take what Banners Broker says or does at face value.
Is this advertising campaign really running through the Banners Broker Choice Network?
No, it’s not.
Banners Broker is serving these ads from ox-d.bannersbroker.com, which can be IP traced to New York City where the server is owned by OpenX Technologies:
OpenX is a powerful ad exchange that offers publishers the chance to sell their own inventory, or broker through the OpenX Market where a number of renowned brands can pick up the scraps. Brands like… WillHill.
It’s debatable whether Banners Broker invested in the Enterprise Edition or the Free Version (for hobbyists), but what certainly isn’t debatable is the fact that these ads you see on the Choice Network do not come from advertisers signing up to BannersBroker.com.
They are sourced from the OpenX Market, probably as remnant traffic.
You could sign up to the same service today and have your very own ‘Choice Network’ up and running in hours.
One thing is for certain, you will soon see that actually, yes, it is possible NOT to make money with the Banners Broker system. The real one, anyway. These ads produce only an industry standard return, nothing like what would be required to turn a bunch of third party investors in to millionaires.
So, what are we to make of all those months where the Choice Network was stuck in ‘Test Mode’? I guess that’s how long it took BB’s in-house programmers to configure OpenX across their portfolio of dud sites.
Changing the face of the online advertising industry?
Yeah, that might take a while.
Note: Thanks to the helpful peeps over at RealScam for piecing together this latest lie. They’ve been tearing the scheme apart with much greater dedication than myself!
Once again, we could forgive the lies surrounding the Choice Network if the flagship Blind Network delivered on its promises. But it doesn’t. And one begins to question whether it ever will…
An Update on My Experience as a Blind Network Advertiser
How many BB investors have actually advertised on the Banners Broker Blind Network? I know a lot of them like to talk about it, as if it’s some kind of revolutionary invention.
But have they actually tried it?
I have.
In my first post, I mentioned how I had setup a campaign on the Blind Network. 7 weeks later, I decided to login and see how my campaign had performed. Boy, what a disappointment.
After negotiating the new security gateway…
(Seriously, who asks for FIVE security questions? Even my bank only needs two. I guess they’re harvesting security answers as well as passports these days…)
I finally reached the reporting section for my test campaign…
Yes, in over 7 weeks of running a broadly targeted campaign on the Blind Network (one category in the UK), I have received a grant total of 866 impressions! That’s a total advertiser spend of just over $0.86 in 7 weeks.
If Banners Broker can’t send 1000 impressions of traffic to a UK campaign in 7 weeks, how in the name of Lucifer’s balls is it able to generate hundreds of millions of dollars in revenue?
Tell me, apologists! How does an advertiser spend millions of dollars on this platform when I can’t even spend ONE dollar in 7 weeks?
What you see above is the Banners Broker’s take on a ‘campaign report’.
So, let’s say I’m a professional media buyer.
Where do I find my breakdown of performance by creative? By channel? By hour? Where do I exclude targets (a damn near critical option for blind networks)?
Banners Broker tells the world that it is paying millions of dollars to its affiliates. Maybe that is the case. But the money is damn sure not coming from advertisers. I beg anybody to test this joke of a system and tell me otherwise.
Banners Broker and Clicksor
If we crawl through the heaps of misinformation on how Banners Broker actually serves its banners, it becomes clear that the company is brokering through Clicksor (a broker within a broker, if you will).
Clicksor is a legitimate company that I have worked with in the past. I’m sorry for sullying their names in the same sentence as Banners Broker, but we have to point out some crucial information:
In the latest 2011 data, Clicksor’s parent company Yesup Ecommerce Solutions Inc posted annual revenue of $17.5 Million dollars.
And yet Banners Broker claims to have paid out over $100 Million dollars, by brokering through Clicksor.
HOW?
Why is Banners Broker’s $100 Million in affiliate payouts not reflected in Clicksor’s accounts? They are receiving the same advertiser trade and they are further up the chain.
We would have to assume that Banners Broker is the only company working with Clicksor, and that Clicksor is the only part of Yesup producing revenue, and even then the maximum revenue pales in significance to what Banners Broker claims to be paying out to its affiliates. The markup must be astro-bloody-nomical.
It’s an economical impossibility.
Which is why Banners Broker has acted quickly to change its story.
David Hooker, BB’s latest snake-oil man, addressed this issue directly at the recent Irish gala.
“His presentation consisted of filling us in completely on how the Blind Network works and how it has 10 major Brokers running it. How Banners Broker linked up with the smaller of these Brokers (Finch: He stresses ‘smaller’ for good reason. He knows the previous numbers and ‘direct relationship’ clearly identified their model as a fraud)) and how now one of the largest Brokers has given green light to link with them. Chris later said that the linking up of software is almost complete and they will soon be good to go.”
If you know anything about advertising through a blind network, this is pretty hilarious.
What advertiser in his right mind is going to work with a broker that re-brokers through any 1 of 10 different networks? Why would the advertiser not just go direct to his broker of choice for half the price… and, screw it, some actual control over his ads?
It’s like me saying, “I want you to give me £1 for an ice cream that we both know you can buy for 50p. Except, I’m not even going to let you decide which ice cream you have. I’ll take that extra 50p and pick whichever of the 10 vans I want to buy it from (even though you may have a preference!). Then I’ll go to a bunch of investors and pitch them my breakthrough idea on the basis that brokering ice cream is the “next big thing” and billions are made every year by doing so. How about we ask for £3000 for the Black Cone Package – ‘Double your Cornettos, Magnums, and Twisters in a month!’ Yeah, pop-business. The proles will love that.“
There’s a problem with the model. People aren’t stupid! They know where they can get their ice cream for 50p, and they are not going to pay you double for less choice and poorer service. The same applies to the Banners Broker business model. Advertisers are not stupid. They are not going to pay Rajiv Dixit and Chris Smith more money in return for less ads and less control over where they appear.
In any case, who are these ’10 major brokers’ that Banners Broker has suddenly started working with? Why no names?
Tell us David, has Clicksor become the “smaller of these brokers” because you’ve been found out – publicly – by claiming to send your traffic through a network whose parent company reports only a tiny fraction of your own claimed revenues? I guess if you announce “10 major brokers” (conveniently without naming them), we can’t look in to their much more transparent workings and directly shoot your bullshit down for what it is.
It’s pretty obvious, isn’t it?
This is a lie aimed squarely at the bullet holes shot in the previous lie.
Note: We know that Banners Broker has been brokering solely through Clicksor because publisher.bannersbroker.com can be IP traced directly to a Clicksor server. Good luck split testing that with your 10 other brokers!
“Get Paid by Turtle Mail“
When working with reputable companies, you expect to also deal with reputable banks.
When working with Banners Broker, that is not the case.
Withdrawal requests are handled in one of three ways:
- The pre-paid BB card
- Solid Trust Pay (STP)
- Payza
The withdrawal methods vary from country to country, but it’s immediately clear that accessing your funds is not going to be as easy as it should be with a world renowned advertising company. There are no cheques, no direct deposit, not even a PayPal option!
With all due respect to Solid Trust Pay and Payza, their brands are known for dealing with the type of Internet businesses that can’t get approved anywhere else. They are staples of the HYIP community. And as for the pre-paid BB card (for some investors, their only option), this is the equivalent to being paid in cash.
You might as well be receiving an iTunes gift card.
Hey, give it 3 months and that will probably be the only payment option left.
There is absolutely no excuse for:
Withdrawal methods that require the user to jump through hoops with notarised ID before he can get his money.
Taking weeks, sometimes months, to process the bloody transactions in the first place. All the while charging the user on time every time for admin processing fees and traffic packs.
Banners Broker will take your money, but pay you only when they feel like it.
Which soon will be never.
They claim that their payouts are running smoothly with minimal backlog. A quick search of the Internet and that is clearly not the case. Selective payments rule the day.
The Tax Conundrum
A wise man once said, “The only thing certain in life is death and taxes.”
All money earned through Banners Broker is taxable, even the money that you haven’t yet withdrawn. Yes, your total account balance would be considered a form of stock in the eyes of the exchequer.
This leads to the rather awkward situation where Banners Broker investors need to be paying tax on income that they haven’t yet received. Failure to do so is in clear breach of the law (I’m referring to the UK, you will need to research this if you live elsewhere).
Let’s get this straight…
You are liable to pay tax on ALL of your “My Total Earnings” minus the costs accrued from account fees and buying traffic packs.
Your account might look like this:
Total Earnings: £15,000
Withdrawals So Far: £2,000
Invested in to the System (Total Costs): £3,000Total Earnings – Total Costs = Taxable Profits
£15,000 – £3,000 = £12,000Basic Tax Rate is 20%
(£12,000 x 0.20) = £2400 now due in tax.
So let’s say you have managed to withdraw £2000 from Banners Broker. You now need to pay the taxman £2400. Doesn’t sound like such a good investment, does it?
You are at a loss.
It’s not going to get better either! The Banners Broker system is designed to exponentially increase your My Total Earnings while allowing you to withdraw only a small fraction of your funds. It’s a bait ploy. But fatally, it assumes that you are the kind of person who doesn’t bother paying tax.
Well, do you?
With the January 31st deadline for self-assessment rapidly approaching, there are a lot of Banners Broker investors that are now required by law to hand ALL of their profits to the taxman while waiting for Banners Broker to pay the rest of their earnings.
Will that happen? Of course not.
If you don’t care about being involved in a ponzi scheme, I highly doubt you care about paying your taxes. But you should start thinking about it.
Lies, Lies, and More Lies
Troy Dooly recently posted an article on MLM Helpdesk writing off Banners Broker as a ponzi scheme. Here’s how Banners Broker chose to deflect the criticism:
Yes, by falsely claiming that the article was written in an attempt to extort money in return for deletion.
Talk about a stroke of twisted genius. I hope Troy sues.
Here’s more from David Hooker on the subject of us pesky bloggers speaking critically of Banners Broker:
“He also talked about how he tackled the bloggers that were writing negative stuff. One was a friend of his and wanted Banners Broker to pay him £900 to correct his negative story!!!!
Another one, when offered the chance to come to BB International to see for himself what Banners Broker does, declined, and said he was broke!”
Hooker wisely opts not to name any names. If he did, he’d be sued to Kingdom Come.
This is the current tactic for deflecting criticism: accuse the blogger of trying to extort money. Well, if I hear even the slightest whisper that this article is written to extort money, I’ll be unleashing a lawyer so far up David Hooker’s arse that his next rousing presentation is delivered directly to a judge.
I guess rejecting all criticism as an attempt at extortion sums up the state of mind at Banners Broker HQ perfectly. What are they scared of in there?
Common Misconceptions
Let’s play some FAQ with the common responses from BB apologists. If you read the comments from the last post, you’ll already be familiar with the holding patterns and the dumbfounded logic.
I’m making XXXX/month from Banners Broker. It’s negative people like you who will never make money online! I’ve quit my job already!
I’ve said it so many times that my fingers are starting to resent the same keyboard bashing:
The fact that you have made some money from Banners Broker does not mean that it is anything less than a ponzi scheme. It just means that you are luckier than the poor suckers further down the food chain.
Important! The high balance in your account does not mean that the money is yours. It is text on a screen. A promise in a hurricane. The money is only yours when it lands in your bank account and for most people, this is the where the frustration begins.
Money withdrawal times are increasing. Payout methods are decreasing. Excuses are growing more and more ridiculous by the day.
Just because a page in cyberspace says that you have $17,000 waiting for you on the other side of the rainbow, that does not make it so. Weigh up how much money you have invested versus how much you have withdrawn. Now do an honest appraisal of the situation: “Have I really made money here? Or have I inherited a gigantic stack of IOUs?”
But I’ve met Chris Smith and Rajiv Dixit in person! A scammer would never show his face in person.
If you believe this, God help your wallet for it is ripeth to be plucked.
History is littered with ponzi schemers that travelled the world to sweet talk their prey. Take a look at Bernie Madoff. He hardly lived in the closet.
Why would a ponzi scheme go on a World Tour if it wasn’t credible?
Good question.
Let me rephrase it.
If Banners Broker is truly about a revolutionary advancement in the online advertising industry, why is the company touring for investors instead of advertisers?
It is advertisers who make the BB world spin round.
They are the ‘alleged’ heart of the business, the rainmakers if you will.
So why is there no evidence that a single Banners Broker advertiser exists? Why does Banners Broker spend its days trawling the world for fifty buck investors when its the big brand advertisers that pay the bills?
This company cannot survive without recruiting a large number of the most reckless advertisers under the sun (who also conveniently have the most extravagant budgets).
How do they recruit these elusive, nonchalant big-spenders (who don’t care which of the 10 networks you throw their ads on for twice the price)?
It’s certainly not by going on tour at advertising trade shows, or reputable conferences, or by offering a single interview to a reputable trade journal.
No, no.
The CEO of Banners Broker prefers to spend his time sharking across the dancefloor at Irish galas, eyeing up the next Primark suit for a Yellow Panel bonanza.
Sourced: http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index123.html
He calls it networking. I call it a waste of bloody time for somebody who *allegedly* has much bigger fish to fry.
You don’t find Zuckerberg skirting for fifty bucks on the outskirts of Mumbai.
How can it be a ponzi? It doesn’t require referrals. I can make money without referring a single soul!
Practically every big player in Banners Broker is sitting on a mountain of referrals. It is the secret sauce behind their incomes.
True, you don’t have to refer people to join the program. But at this stage in the game, you are going nowhere fast if you choose to sit still, waiting for your panels to progress. This program is designed in such a way that dragging in more investors is the safest way to guarantee your own investment.
If you think the program can survive without referrals, you might want to consider this latest nugget from the Banners Broker blog:
“BB will be around as long as affiliates want to remain a part of the program”
Freud must be smiling in his grave.
Banners Broker is approved by MasterCard. Do you really think MasterCard would approve a ponzi scheme to use their cards?
This is such a nasty little lie that Banners Broker has been forced to tell its affiliates that, actually, there is no approval from Mastercard, and indeed no backing whatsoever. Banners Broker buys its pre-paid Mastercards from Vector, an independent reseller.
If you think there is a legitimate relationship between MasterCard and Banners Broker, I would advise that you keep it to yourself. Banners Broker are now so hypersensitive about this damaging lie that they are terminating the accounts of users who imply any such relationship exists.
If it was really a scam, it would have collapsed already.
There are some ponzi schemes that have lasted 20 years and there are others that have crashed and burned in 20 days.
If you believe that size or longevity defines a ponzi, let me assure you: it doesn’t.
It only defines how memorable the ultimate collapse will be.
In Summary: What is Really Happening?
For those of you who don’t have the time or attention to read all of the above, here is the bullet point breakdown of what is currently happening with Banners Broker, and what you can expect to happen over the coming months.
Your Panel Movements Will Grind to a Halt – Thousands of BB members are already reporting that their panels have been static for days, and that they have been slowing over the last few weeks. There’s a very simple explanation for this. Banners Broker doesn’t have the cashflow to pay what it owes, or to deliver the returns that it is promising you. Certainly not over the Christmas period where members are rushing to withdraw. Your panels are going to move slowly probably for the rest of Banners Broker’s very short-lived existence.
Withdrawals Will Continue to Take Forever – It’s not going to get better. The Banners Broker program is showing severe signs that it is overstretched. You don’t need me to tell you that withdrawal times are getting worse. Compare them to six months ago.
More ‘World Tours’ – Banners Broker is losing the online battle for publicity (with articles like my last swamping their brand at the top of Google), which is why it is throwing resources in to offline ‘tours’ as a means of recruiting new investors. This looks set to continue in to the new year with a tour of India planned. Will Banners Broker make it that far? I couldn’t possibly say. But if you’d like a long list of ‘deeply troubling questions’ to ask them in person, feel free to email me.
The Press Will Continue to Circle – The Sunday World has reported three negative stories in three weeks on Banners Broker. The Irish Examiner is also chiming in. I know for a fact that at least two major UK newspapers are interested in the fate of the scheme, as I’ve been speaking to them personally. Expect to hear lots more negative press about Banners Broker in the following weeks. The knives are being sharpened from all angles.
The Trolls, Shills & Pimps Will Blitz the Comments – The slightest hint of criticism and they always do. Just ask yourself, “What is their motivation?” If they were really making money from Banners Broker (and I’m sure some of them are), why do they care what anybody else thinks? The reason they defend this program so devoutly is because their future income depends on it. I hope that this post convinces you to think twice about your own.
Is Banners Broker ‘Definitely’ a Ponzi Scheme?
In my last post, I came to the judgment that Banners Broker is a well-disguised ponzi scheme. I stand by that judgment.
In the comments, I faced a lot of questions from readers who thought I couldn’t possibly say with ‘100% conviction’ that it is definitely a ponzi scheme. As much as it pains me to admit this, they are correct.
Theoretically, there is still a tiny chance that Banners Broker isn’t a ponzi scheme. Until the inevitable collapse, there remains a tiny shred of doubt.
The problem for those who back Banners Broker is that it is down to them to answer: “If Banners Broker isn’t a ponzi scam, what could it possibly be?”
The existing business model is riddled with flaws and impossibilities. There is simply no way that the money being paid to investors could have been delivered by online advertisers in the model that Banners Broker is claiming. Zero chance.
And that’s where this research ends.
If you believe that Banners Broker can operate as something other than a ponzi scam and deliver such spectacular returns, you are welcome to carry on believing, to keep on throwing your savings at the cause.
If, like many, you are coming to suspect the workings behind Banners Broker for something more sinister, you may wish to cancel your ticket to the BB World Tour, roll out your mock-Bannatyne accent and repeat this loud and clear:
“I’m out.“
Oh, and Finch, those BB millionaires? One has popped up on the BB F&A site. Name of Martin Wilde, pushing the BB tour to Manchester. He says he is a BB millionaire (after 14 months) and “committed to everything I do”.
Tickets are £30 with £45 for the “Gala Dinner” with an “awesome dance floor”. Sounds like a bargain to me.
@D Pressed
“And so the Aussie toddled off to the police station, realising he’d been completely ripped off and robbed…Or at least he would, if, most pertinently, he’s been born with the brain of a New Zealander. Or a chicken.”
Best paragraph on here for a while!! Don’t you let anyone else tell you anything different. I think you’re wonderful. 😀
DD
@RFJ …. yes ofc you have been in their office 2 weeks ago saw the youtube video with the IC intervieuws …. strange that an video about an office visit is made whith only an intervieuw and you DON’T ACTUALY SEE THE OFFICE … only thing you can see is the IC’s intervieuwed sitting in a cheap sofa telling about how wonderfull the office is but sadly enough no footage about the office not one picture … or LET ME GUESS its TOP secret so concurents can’t buy the same furniture you have …. rofl
kind regards
brenie
It was the usual line. We are behind in payments…you will receive payments soon…blah, blah, blah.
That excuse gets old after 2 months.
RJF: What is the address of the building you went for a tour of in Toronto?
Standard for convention is £30 eWallet-able.
Gala is £45. No eWallet! ONLY HARD CASH. (Bad news for bb-millonaires?)
Combo is…?
Hello friends,
I’m so….I have no words…thats the best thingh since Jez walks on the weater!
In FinchSalesBlog version 1.5302 the split-reply-function is automated! The algorithm is still a bit wanky-wonky but its about 400 relpies for one split.
You’ll love it. Grd times ahead, very great times!
So long
Have agreed weekend
So they won’t accept BB dollars for the gala, only real money. BB really is in trouble…
Biggest sign yet…
Dear Aussie BBer
You say:
“Let’s say you work for a company and outside work hours you hop online and tell the world that Company XYZ you work for are a bunch of scammers, would it not be reasonable for you to be terminated by your employer, or at the very least reprimanded for your actions?”
Well….no. As a shop steward with a major Union, I can tell you that before anyone could be summarily dismissed, or even given a warning, there would be a long drawn out process during which all the facts would be looked at and the company’s disciplinary policies examined thoroughly to make sure that all actions were in line with agreed policies. The process would have stages, including an appeal stage. Each stage would (or should be) be heard by different people. And that’s before we get to Employment Tribunals.
In this case, the BB case, it seems as if BB is both judge and jury and the affiliate has no chance to put their side of the story. What is more, BB’s affilates are NOT EMPLOYEES. If anything, it could be argued that they are customers of BB, if, as some say, it is selling a product which they are buying. So what right has BB to lock them out of their account and take their money because it thinks they have been “negative” about them?
Imagine if I bought a jumper in Marks and Spencer and it fell apart at the first wash so I took it back to complain; but instead of giving me a refund or a fresh jumper, they took the old one, snatched my credit card and told me I was banned from shopping with them for life because I’d been bad mouthing their company! That would simply not happen because M&S has excellent customer service standards.
Pity the same cannot be said for BB.
This account synchro gif image at starting page is funny.
I got feeling that they are playing with affiliates just to get more time.
Not only withdrawals are slowed but even panels had stopped.
OMG, i give 1% chance that this is not over, wich means i feel like 99% looser.
Lucky i was suspecious at the beginnig and invested just few bucks.
@Della Cate
Agree with you on all points. You are not comparing like with like though. M & S exist in the real world, BB doesn’t.
DD
Dear Ditto Ditto
Oh, I know. But you can see what I’m gatting at!
Cheers.
Or even “getting at” (apologies, typo)
Della C
Thanks Aussie-Non-Aussie. Glad you enjoyed the virtual chicken debate. 🙂 Unfortunately, yours is still entirely tasteless and yet is so rotten it stinks!
Btw…If credibility had anything to do with forum names, we’d have had the real Chris Smith on here, rather than a fake!….you’ll have needed to have read the thread though to realise that. 😉
Della Cate:… “Banners Broker International holds the rights to deny any withdrawal request submitted”
If ever a single sentence summed up what BB is all about, that is it….We reserve the right to STEAL your money!
In other terms and conditions:
Oh, and we hold the rights to sell your personal information for the purposes of identity theft, to the highest bidder.
Has there ever been any similar contract in the entire history of Capitalism which contained clauses as one-sided and transparently fraudulent as these? Yet still the shills trill.
BB isn’t a golden goose. It’s a clockwork chicken. Unfortunately, as AndrewAU explains, it’s difficult to snap off its wings with so many Ostriches burying their heads in their panels.
P.S. I think you’ve finally GOT me Ditto Ditto! In a good way. 🙂
I wonder if Nick is still ‘100% sure’ I’m a BB plant?….If so, he’d have to accept I’m doing a bloody awful job at presenting BBI in a favourable light. Even worse than TS! 😮
Is anyone from here or Realscam going to Manchester?
Re – Terry’s comment:
“When someone for example openly posts negative comments on a blog such as this, those comments damage the company, so the company can lock the account of the abusing
member, and the member forfeits any fees paid and revenues earned to compensate the company for any damage their comments have caused. You can call it unfair, but, how else is the company to retrieve their losses at the hands of people that would openly do them harm?”
BB does not have the legal right to keep a members funds that he has earned. If BB’s business has been damaged, due to negative comments as claimed, then they have the option file a legal claim for losses and let the courts decide what the damages are. That’s like saying a person who makes negative comments about his Bank gives the Bank the right to lock the person’s Bank account and keep his life savings. Not in this country it doesn’t.
Of course any company running a Ponzi scheme would want to stay as far away as possible from any lawsuits where they would have to disclose their source of revenue.
Ken Roklin
Does that mean you can take BB to court to get your money back if they shut down your account ?
My panels have slowed down and there`s still no sign of any money being transfered onto my BBcard which i just got charged 35 bucks for by the way , some sort of activation fee ? They took it out of my e wallet which has left me short for the traffic pack im signed up for every month . Im deffo not going to give them any more money so they will more than likely close my account now because i failed on the traffic pack payment . Its like their are keeping my panels from maturing so i miss the traffic pack deadline , i got two purple panels which are about to mature but they are just not moving
Bongo
If it were me I would pay the $50 and take them to Small Claims Court.
There is a lot of whining on this blog and not one person has filed a complaint with the respective authorities or lawsuit….put your money where your mouth.
@BBinsider….google their current address and go yourself….I’ve been there and its very nice.
Didn’t Apple start in a garage? what about Dell (garage)? Google? Facebook (college dorm)? Microsoft (basement)? and now their gazillionaires with investors money….whos laughing to the bank now?…ROTFL
re: RJF
“Didn’t Apple start in a garage? what about Dell (garage)? Google? Facebook (college dorm)? Microsoft (basement)? and now their gazillionaires with investors money….whos laughing to the bank now?…ROTFL”
The companies you mention all had a product. Their investors were also real companies who received shares in the company.
BB has a scheme, not a product and the only investors are individuals with no shares in the company. BB itself states that it requires new affiliate sig-ups to run its business. If BB is making so much money why would they need to keep signing up new members unless the business is just that – signing up new members to pay off existing ones (the definition of a Ponzi scheme).
Who’s laughing to the bank now? The owners of BB and their initial members who have a ton of members in their down-line.
Nice try RJF. So you went for a tour of their offices yet you do not know the address. Haha! You are really going to instill confidence in the next wave of suckers. Pull the other one!
BB is done. Anyone who throws money at it now deserves what they get.
No one will be laughing when BB collapses or gets shut down. The crooks will be off to prison and the affilates who have made any profit will be pursued by the taxman and/or the fraud investigators. There are affiliates currently living the dream, but that’s because they either don’t know or don’t care to know how their profit has evolved. At this stage of the game they have no excuses imo.
That’s why I’m glad I found this blog and other websites, which helped me understand what I’d signed up to. It’s all very well for those who know about Ponzis and Pyramids to suggest the likes of me should have realised this from day onel but the model was misrepresented and mis-sold at the presentations given by ID and others last year. Hence it was sold as a viable business of which affiliate money formed a relatively modest proportion of the money generated.
These aren’t my words regarding mis-selling, but those of Terry Stern…the same Terry Stern who thinks it’s okay to confiscate my money on the basis that I now KNOW (via him) I was lied to by BB, and believe it is the honest and decent thing to say so here, there and everywhere!
The only alternative is to ignore the facts, never say a bad word about BB in case it ‘damages their business’, pocket as much cash as I can, while I can, if I can….and end up in a situation whereby, eventually, that money will be confiscated anyway.
I know of one person (via a friend of a friend I was talking to last weeek) who has withdrawn over £4,000 cash on his Vector card because he was one of the first to get hold of one. He’s spent the lot on luxuries; a new TV, holidays etc. He has about 30 affiliates in his direct downline earning him commissions; so he’s doing very well for now….except that he’s not even considered the implications in terms of tax payable on money he’s no longer got. Nor that when BB ends, he’ll be in serious trouble for profiting from a Ponzi/pyramid scam.
Whatever annoyance/disappointment I have felt about being conned at the presentation (which is effectively what Stern told us had happened, yet he says I am damaging his business by repeating that fact!), it is more than tempered by the relief that I’ve seen the light…or the shite!..and therefore will never take a penny out of my account more than I put into it, even if someone handed me an active Vector Card tomorrow.
Some have said it’s wrong to even take out what I put in because the money comes from new affilates, but I and others who know far more about the mechanics of BB, have made a great effort to expose BB for what it is. None of this information was available when I and many others were ripped off by the fake sales pitch. Anyone signing up now has the opportunity to Google BB and find plenty of reality-check factual negativity on the net and to make a much more informed opinion.
ALL of the evidence points to that opinion being a resounding NO to getting involved with BB on moral, ethical or financial grounds. If they choose to ignore the truth and go with the hype, I can’t sympathise or empathise with them. Hence, I have no qualms about getting a refund via their stupidity/greed.
I believe though, that no method exists, because I will not be applying for their shabby Vector Card, even though it would keep a flicker of hope alive of getting my money back. In some ways that’s for the best though. I’ve lost money. I know that. I have a clear conscience. I enjoy that. Peace of mind is far more important to me than a new TV or a couple of weeks in Barbados followed by the dawning of a day in the future when someone says I owe them £X,000’s in tax or stolen profit. And they want it now, otherwise Her Majesty’s Prison Service will be providing board and lodgings to me for the following few years.
Even so, I’m still looking forward to the day when BB starts trying to recruit new affiliates in open meetings (rather than preach to the converted in Manchester at £40 a go)…..because, as Terry Stern suggested when he invited us over for a coffee, it will be fun to catch up with those guys…but not in their comfort zone. In mine! I’m always up for a brawl in a pub! 😉
@BBinsider…..thats ok…I don’t have to prove anything to you….if you can’t look it up yourself and do your own homework….your lose not mine…I’m heading to the bank to withdraw some funds from BB that I’ve earned…cheers everyone…haha!
PS….One million Affiliates by the end of the year! (anticipated)…sounds like a growing company to me….haha
andreasheinz says:
February 2, 2013 at 12:44 am
“WHICH COUNTRY’S CORPORATE LAW DOES BBI FALL UNDER??? If I wish to take legal action in a court, which jurisdiction should I approach??”
Ontario, Canada. (oups!)
Ahh, you see that’s why we now have all this Stellar Point nonsense. According to the Teflon one SP are merely agents for BBI, who are based in a desk drawer in Belize or a filing cabinet on the Isle of Man, but not in Canada where there are policemen and jails…
RJF i`d never tire from punching someone like you , your an out and fucking tool .
where did you go RFJ … ?? you visited the stellar point offices if i am correct not the BBI because thats another companie …. i have asked BBI already 2 times now where my solicitor should contact them on wich adres gues what mister hahaha ( verry mature )… no answer till today … but thats the way you BB idiots run arround and come on blogs that speak negative about BB it is hurting your business and the only thing you can say is “i don’t need to proove anything” …. well people if you are doing due dilligence about banner brokers that say’s enoug THEY DONT NEED TOO PROOVE ANYTHING just give your money and well if your lucky you get some back but don’t count on it 😉 ….. AHHHHH almost forgot you go to the bank and withdraw some more money THATS THE BIGGEST PROOVE its a legit business isn’t it RFJ ….. oh and 1 million affiliates by the end of the year ( anticipated ) ZEEK was a ponzi and had 1 million affiliates so what proove is that ?? like i said to your dear Mr Terry Stern if you would go to the proper media / chanels with your marvellous product you would have 1 trillion affiliates by the end of the year only if the business is legit OFC but NOOOOO its better to keep it secret and Mr Smith and co travels the world to attrackt mostely old peeps in there pension age … oeps sorry affiliates
kind regards
brenie
I think we should all turn up at the manchester event and demand answers from these maggots , starting with that fat cunt who calls himself chris smith . Im going and im going to bring a small army .
D. Pressed you are one self righteous son of a bitch. So you got scammed because there wasn’t enough info out there and anyone who gets scammed now deserves it? What a crock of shit. The writing was on the wall from day one as much as it is today, all it takes is a bit of logic and to not be blinded by greed.
There is no such thing as no risk double your money, never has, never will. Get it? Any program that takes in money from little old ladies rather institutional investors is most likely a scam. Clear as day. Point to the flaw in that logic.
How dare you insult people who have fallen victim to the same scam as you? You’re a moron and a bore.
Please tell me what do you think you’re bringing to this debate? You only seem to want to try to pander to your own ego. Bring ANYTHING new and relevant to this debate rather that reams of uninteresting detritus.
Please just crawl under the rock you came from and stop making it harder to bring the truth to the fore, you are not even a tenth as intelligent as you think you are and you are a like a baby playing with the big boys.
@bongo ROFL please take a video! Would love to see the fireworks!
You are right. You don’t have to prove anything to me. I know you are a liar. And now thanks to your tall tales, everyone else does too.
BB must be delighted(NOT) to have ambassadors like you. Haha, you’ll single-handedly shut the whole cycler down.
Posted a link to Terrys QA to a friend, his friend who is an idiot responded to him via text, it’s hilarious:
“The minds of morons reading blogs from a self confessed internet crook who openly admits that he sells shit ot people that they neither need nor want. Doesn;t the name Finch. SELLS…..ring any alarm bells with these fuckwits.
FACT…….new offices opening in Manchester.
FACT…….World tour coming to manchester in 3 weeks
FACT…….YOU’RE MAKING MONEY
FACT…….I’M MAKING MONEY
FACT…….YOU’VE PUT NO MORE IN
FACT…….I’VE PUT NO MORE IN
FACT…….NEW OFFICES IN INDIA
FACT…….NEW OFFICES IN CARRIBEAN
FACT…….NOT ENOUGH PEOPLE PAYING IN FOR US TO BE PAID OUT WHAT WE GET.
FACT INTERNET ADVERTISING IS A TRILLION DOLLAR INDUSTRY.
FACT…….* KNOWS NOTHING AND NEITHER DOES HIS MATE.
FACT…….BLODE DOWN THE PUB KNOWS MORE THAN THESE DICK HEADS.
What a guy
@bongo….name calling???…very mature…..That just adds volumes of credibility for you…..lol
@BBinsider….embassadors??? not at all…just gave my honest opinion.
@Brenier……Jump on a plane to Toronto, Canada….check it out for yourself. Whats stopping you?…money you don’t have? again where are the lawsuits and complaints???
It just goes to show that any truth that is spoken will ALWAYS ALWAYS be shot down by the likes of BBinsider, D.Pressed, Brenie, bongo and the likes.
BTW Brenie…I DO have a life…I don’t wait in front of a computer for your response hence the 2 day delay….unlike yourself…..also keep the TRAFFIC going on here and everywhere else cause that helps to make me money….haha
Cheers
@RFJ … rofl you have a life and i have a life so ?? … mine will be one that you never will have or had 😉 … but thats beside the question …. but there you go so i should jump in a plane and go to Toronto ?? to visit what ?? Stellar Point ?? thought we were talking about BBI … your Mr Stern himself said Stellar point is another companie and IS NOT Banners Broker international … BBI is a client of stellar point so why should i go and check out another companie’s office ???
but great that you can’t give answers … but i am sure you took great pictures off the office in Toronto while you where there …so show us RJF i am sure its nothing to keep secret how Stellar Point offices look like 😉
kind regards
brenie
@RJF
“One million Affiliates by the end of the year! (anticipated)…sounds like a growing company to me….haha”
OK, let’s see now. 100 mil affiliates means that BB would have to pay out approximately $1 billion a month to their members.
Statistics show that companies like BB very rarely last longer than 3 years and peak at around 300,000members. The reason being that the payback to members on a monthly basis is starting to be more than what they bring in with new sign-ups. This is the time when you see payments being late and/or accounts blocked. The only ones still getting paid are the owners of course and the members who were in it early as they need these members for testimonials to show how great the company is and how much money they can make.
The reasons given for being late are always the same: upgrades to software, upgrades to servers due to the huge volume, etc. You can see this trend by reading the posts in the forums of “Direct Marketing/MLM” companies as they all start the shut down process the same way beginning with late payments and eventually no payments with the same excuses. The money is in an offshore bank account and can’t be touched. The owners then start another “direct marketing” company with a full database of hundred of thousands of people. The ones who made money with them will join them in their new scam. This is repeated every 2 to 3 years. Nice business – for some. Just look at the history of Raj and Chris.
They seldom get brought to justice as members are reluctant to band together and take them to court. Complaints to the authorities that they are running a Ponzie scheme go nowhere as not enough complaints are filed.
IT’S FUNNY TO READ ALL THIS BULLSHIT!
WHY SO INTERESTED IN BANNERSBROKER?
LEAVE THEM ALONE!
You are a liar RFJ. You wouldn’t know honesty if it hit you over the head.
Sadadada, you better look up the meaning of the word ‘fact’.
Can’t leave them alone Marnikoo. They have my money and I can’t get paid. Me and many many others.
@brenie….thats ok…I’ve seen it…thats all that matters
@bbinsider…Liar?…so anyone can state their opinion on here and if its contrary to what you believe…their a liar?….ROTFL
thats ok…i just checked my ewallet today…..doing another withdrawal and buying more panels…:)…cheers mate!
Keep the Traffic going…it helps me and all the BBers out there.
BTW…I know of at least 15 affiliates that have not signed anyone else up and their making money…..go figure (oh yes, and some have withdrawn some of their funds)….haha
Keep spewing your lies, liar. Noone believes you any more.
@brenie….I can guarantee you that if I walked through Googles offices taking inside pictures….I’d be escorted out and arrested…..haha
So what if they outsource part of there business…most companies do anyways…Ford?…Chrysler?..Chevy?…Honda?..and most toys…Check the label…”Made in China”…Please!
@BBinsider….”Keep spewing your lies, liar. Noone believes you any more.”…..I hope your not a judge?…”Off with their Heads!!!!….Sire”
haha
I don’t need to be a judge, your lies are obvious for all to see. Do me a favour though. Please don’t give up posting, you are tearing the BB case to shreds with your stupidity.
@BBinsider….No worries Mate!
Come on liar, tell us another lie. Try to make this one a little more convincing.
Dear RJF, I don’t know which country you hail from, but I trust that you and your chums are declaring your massive extra income to the tax man?
HMRC in the UK would be very keen to hear from you to ensure you declare all your income and are taxed properly. They are running adverts in the UK reminding people that they are “closing in on undeclared income”….
Kind regards
Hey dear RFJ you dont need to go inside google offices and get arrested taking pictures … they have opened a new office in Toronto on the 13 of november 2012 and made it public ….. unlike Stellar Point/BBI …. dont think you are neighbours but Stellar point but asume the offices you have visited are similar 😉 … LOOK GOOGLE SHOW their offices to the world i asume they have nothing to hide and not worried about competition …. you don’t need to go to jail RJF to look into an office 😉 real company’s show them to the world 😉
visit the office in Toronto go on the link beneath
have a nice tour RJF rofl
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlyRQTft4sY
kind regards brenie
Has anyone here contacted Facebook or Linked-In about Banners Brokers? I notice BB’ers use these sites to attract more victims/affiliates, I doubt eitehr company would want to be associated with BB.
RJF says:
February 3, 2013 at 9:53 am
So what if they outsource part of there business…most companies do anyways…Ford?…Chrysler?..Chevy?…Honda?..and most toys…Check the label…”Made in China”…Please!
Correction; they outsource ALL of their business, if Carlow Ct (which BB say THEY bought) belongs to SP then BBI have *no* offices and *no* staff of their own.
You also may like to know that Stellar Point’s “other`’ clients are all fabrications from the mind of Raj Dixit and, much like banners, they don’t exist outside the world of the BB affiliate.
Imagine RJF associating himself with a world of fabrications…
Why am I not surprised.
@Della Cate…absolutely….i agree…declare your income…i have no qualms about that….anyone who doesn’t will suffer the consequences.
@BBinsider….Liar!
haha
Still claim you went to BB’s offices in Toronto?
Thanks Nick… I appreciate your comments because they expose you for what you are. I’m now 100% certain that you’re a very unpleasant man indeed. I trust others will form a similar opinion of you after that brain-bursting blowout of yours.
Talk about ego; you can’t bear the fact that I sussed you out ages ago and that you were 100% wrong in all your assumptions about me. You would apologise if you had one sliver of decency in you, but you haven’t. Hence your disgusting rant, aka hanging yourself on your own petard.
Is that what you call debating up there in Ad Land? If it is, I’m also 100% certain I’ve brought more to this debate than you have. 🙂
Talking of babies playing with the big boys…You like to play with Finch don’t you Nick? He’s a big boy too in the advertising/marketing world. But do you know that Finch’s mummy is a BB affiliate? Yes…she didn’t even bother asking her own ‘expert’ son if BB was a scam before signing up! And that she phoned BB last week to find out where her money is…and told them that she is Finch’s mummy!!…. Isn’t that an extraordinary sequence of events on so many levels?
Is your mummy in BB too Nick? If so (or even if not), I suggest you and Finch spend a bit more time potty training each other, rather than shooting peas out of your pizzles at people with poise! 🙂
@BBinsider…;)
Glad to see you giving up on that lie. Horrible feeling when you get caught out and its all recorded on the blog…haha.
Gee and Google is almost 15 years old…Of coarse they have a nice office…..
BTW in August of 1998 Sun co-founder Andy Bechtolsheim writes a check for $100,000 to an entity that doesn’t exist yet: a company called Google Inc
in Sept
Google sets up workspace in Susan Wojcicki’s garage at 232 Santa Margarita, Menlo Park.
HAHAHAHAHA
you can google that yourself i hope
At least google had an address…
How about this one:
The history of Microsoft began on April 4, 1975, when it was founded by Bill Gates …. Microsoft did not have an operating system when they closed the deal with ……
MS didn’t have a product…just a concept….
hahaha
That comment is even stupid by your standards.
oh lookie here:
Apple…
Steve Jobs begin working on the company that is now known as Apple in 1978. He and a group of friends began the company in his mom’s garage in Cupertino, California.
Mom’s Garage??? go figure
haha
…which had an address. Whats BB’s address?
“That comment is even stupid by your standards.”
Thats all you got?…just one liners?
oh come now…BBinsider…your responses are just too predictable…you can do better than that…can’t you?
Whats BB’s address? You, know, the place you supposedly visited?
G – O – O – G – L – E IT!…;)
I have, it doesn’t exist. Funny, that you were able to visit somewhere that doesn’t exist…
Have your lawyer look it up for your lawsuit…cheers
You can’t look up something that doesn’t exist. And you certainly can’t visit something that doesn’t exist.
rofl …. RJF you are too good to be true … at least you made me laugh …. yeps and all the companies you name you can indeed google and you will get all information about founders ,CEA, adress, what they business is all about and so on 😉 only thing you find if you goggle BBI its linked to scam … is BB a scam ??? and then you get to your lovely websites that tells people NO BB is not a scam what a way to introduce you business isn’t it RJF you need to convince first pees its not a scam and then you try and overload them with you companie BS … yes ofc Google, MS and Apple started with are we a scam …. NOOOOO we are a legit business 😉
kind regards
brenie
Cheers everyone…..off to watch the Super Bowl!
Ahh, this forum is a hoot! ALL of human life is here….along with a fair smattering of sub-human life! Eh Nick? 😉
Are you going to berate Finch’s mum for not caring who pays her refund now even though she must know as well as I do it HAS to come from fresh mugs? Yet I don’t begrudge her attempts to get her dosh back. After all, her son has done more than most to inform would be BB-ers that it’s a bum steer. And if Finch thought she was acting immorally, he would be having words with his mum, not reporting her concerted efforts to extract whatever she can from the theiving BBBastards of Belize.
Or is behaving in the manner of a rational adult beyond you and your potty-mouthed petulance? 🙂
I can confirm, that unlike Finch’s mum I have NEVER phoned support. I’m clearly not as desperate as she is get my hands on the filthy lucre. And we don’t all do due diligence by YOU TUBE you twerp…the straightline doubler crap was not part of the presentation that was shown and explained to prosepective affiliates last year. I’d never heard of such a thing. And it seems, that neither had Finch’s mum. Even though she only had to ask him what he thought of this scheme she was getting involved in. I wish I had a relative who knew the finer points of internet marketing. Even if it were my 2nd cousin twice removed I’d have been on the phone. Yet Mrs Finch Snr. felt disinclined to seek counsel from the product of her womb! Extraordinary! 😮
Who is insulting whom from a ‘victim’ persepective in those circumstances Nickelarse?
In other news, according to the ‘events’ diary, BB are holding two open information evenings in hotels…One is on the 1st Feb. and one is on the 2nd Feb. Yes, that’s right…..However, neither appeared on the events page until late on the 2nd Feb! In other words, they created two fictional meetings for the dashboard diary, to give the impression that the UK ‘tour’ is still active!
@RJF
Were Steve Jobs and Apple still operating from their mom’s garage after they became a 100 million dollar company?No multimillion dollar company operates that way,I guess BB is that [s]stupid[/s] special,huh?
I submitted that way too early
@RJF
Google moved out of their garage months after going into business ,BB stayed there for 2 years.Google had a spanking corporate HQ 2 years into service,BB was still in a garage.
Where was Microsoft at the same stage of BB at the moment?Oh yeah , the had tangible service and a client list .BB still have none.
Maybe somebody is able to explain me this sequence “If the card is not available in your country, then $5k will be paid via the payment method appropriate to your country”. My impression was that BBI is only relying on payment options which are available all over the world…
Terry Stern: In order for the automated software to work properly for everyone, the company needs to have options that everyone can use. Since PayPal doesn’t work for every country, and bank transfers become complicated with some countries, in addition to placing additional delays on the time it takes for payments to propagate, additionally, some affiliates that come from poorer countries may not have bank accounts due to the complications involved in getting one. Since the system needs to provide options that accommodate all affiliates, only those methods that can actually be used by every affiliate are considered and used. The BB Card is an approved method of transferring funds accepted by all countries we do business with, provides the shortest amount of time to process, and enables an affiliate to gain access to their funds quickly.
Yes PPM, but Terry was lying through his teeth and so are BB. So whatever is told to you should be taken with a grain of salt. BB don’t have enough money to cover payments any more.
The excuses don’t have to make sense, and if they contradict each other that doesn’t really matter. Just read between the lines to know whats happening.
D. Pressed, you really are a sorry scumbag aren’t you.
Go back and read my post again you numskull I said that I would personally withdraw my invested money too, I was just stating a fact for those who were trying to moralize the issue.
What does it matter whether Finch’s mum invested, YOU invested and no matter who has a relative who is in the business or not YOU could have realized it was a scam, just the same as anyone else (including me and Finch). Stop insulting other people who have lost money when you are in EXACTLY the same boat as them.
You really are truly pathetic kicking people when they are down for no other reason than to stroke your over-inflated ego.
I have invested in BB a short while ago and the people that told me about BB actually got their credit card and are withdrawing money from it. they got their investment back and all they do now is making profit. even if BB is a scam it doesnt matter because if u secure your investment then the rest is just about making profit and being patient. as long as you can get money from the profit that u make and reinvesting it while already securing your original investment then i dont see the entire point of this discussion. money is money as simple as that. and im seeing people getting their money and making profit so why shouldnt i?
The problem is, we can’t get our money! When did you join up? How much have you withdrawn? What was your original investment?
If you look across the different forums you will see that people can no longer withdraw money. BB is in trouble. And anyone who invested is in trouble.
The shills have gone pretty quiet in the last few weeks.
A few belated attempts at bending half-truths, but I think most individuals connected to BannersBroker are now aware of what they’re dealing with, if they weren’t already.
It certainly seems that way by the search traffic finding it’s way to this site.
Whereas 2 months ago traffic came from terms like:
Banners Broker
Is Banners Broker legit?
Make money with Banners Broker
Banners Broker success
XXX per month Banners Broker
The majority of traffic now comes from…
Banners Broker no payments
Banners Broker scam
Banners Broker slow panels
Banners Broker not paying
Banners Broker ponzi
Report banners broker
Banners Broker fraud
Raj Dixit fraud
Chris Smith scammer
If search traffic is an indicator of public sentiment, that sentiment has most definitely turned sour.
Oh, and while checking blog stats, I’ve noticed multiple visits from anti-fraud agencies in Holland, India and Canada. Including the office of the General Attorney in Canada (searching for info on a ‘Banners Broker scam’ no less).
Say what you like, trolls and shills.
The net is closing, and your game is almost up.
@finch, this is great news, I am so pleased that the net is finally closing in and the authorities have got themselves involved.
We should carry on making noise until the plug is finally pulled, keep complaining to media, action fraud, mastercard, facebook, linked in, local MP’s, media programmes on TV & Radio, etc. etc.
One last push as they say….
I think BB will fall on its own sword before the authorities get round to it.
They’ve already effectively killed off payments for those without BB cards. I expect the final excuse will be when ‘Vector terminates the card based on false information’ and leaves 100% of members with 0% withdrawal methods.
There’s always an excuse lined up.
Okay Nick…. Find the part of my post ANYWHERE that insults people like me who have lost money?
This is what I said:
Some have said it’s wrong to even take out what I put in because the money comes from new affilates, but I and others who know far more about the mechanics of BB, have made a great effort to expose BB for what it is. None of this information was available when I and many others were ripped off by the fake sales pitch. Anyone signing up now has the opportunity to Google BB and find plenty of reality-check factual negativity on the net and to make a much more informed opinion.
ALL of the evidence points to that opinion being a resounding NO to getting involved with BB on moral, ethical or financial grounds. If they choose to ignore the truth and go with the hype, I can’t sympathise or empathise with them. Hence, I have no qualms about getting a refund via their stupidity/greed.
Nick…Only a complete cretin could interpret ‘their’ as meaning current affiliates.
I stated ‘Anyone signing up now’….Do I need to put it in capital letters for you…? ANYONE SIGNING UP NOW (and of course, by implication), in the FUTURE.
Also note that I used the word ‘CHOOSE’ and not ‘chose’. That’s the present tense Nick, again referring to prospective ‘investors’, not past ones.
And you accuse ME of not reading your post carefully enough! If you take my post as ‘moralizing’, then we are in agreement! Yet you are so stupid that you can’t see the difference between past, present and future.
As for your assertion that I would/should/must have known at the time what BB is about, again, that’s an idiotic statement. I COULD have searched you tube for the BB promotional ad from 2010, but that wouldn’t have proven anything. Terry Stern openly admitted that ID and others MISREPRESENTED the scheme to potential affiliates at their invitational meetings. This is where they signed people up last year. The MISREPRESENTATION involved them presenting a viable business model that involved major advertisers paying into the system.
I have previously stated it seemed too good to be true to me at the time, but I am no expert in how your business works in terms of profit margins. I do now KNOW that the model offered ludicrous returns even if it was based on sound principles.
Anyone signing up NOW has the information to hand via legitimate sources, icluding this blog which appears on Google a click or two away from BB’s own website. That is in some small part down to ME and others who have accepted the truth, debunked Terry Stern and kept this thread very active such that it stays accessible to anyone considering BB who isn’t already stuck with it. As such I your personal attacks are entirely borne out of malice because I’ve shown time and again that just because you work in internet advertising doesn’t give you special status to insult people. In fact it proves to me that internet marketeers/advertisers generally are not to be trusted without very strong reasons to trust them. I wouldn’t trust you as far as you could throw me…which is about an inch seeing as how feeble you are and how fat I am! 🙂
I’m not going to trade abusive insults with you Nick because my explanation in reference to my previous post PROVES that you failed to grasp my point. As such, you’re a ‘numskull’, if I’m allowed to use the technical term for someone whose brain is deficient in its ability to reason.
😉
Can you imagine the chaos within BB if even just 1,000 members in each country were to file a claim for money owed to them by BB in small claims court?
i invested 350 dollars and my upline already withdrawed money from the credit card they recently got.
@wavseeker
Sure, you paid in and they withdrew it. What have you withdrawn to date?
wavseeker: so you haven’t made any money?
not yet but they have and they have been only been doing it for like 3 months
Have they made a profit?
yup, they invested 500 dollars and they withdrawn 1200 dollars
And they are only in it 3 months? How big is their down line?
@wavseeker
Isn’t BB great. They charge you 5% (processing fee) to withdraw your own money. Question – how much interest are they paying you for the amount of money you earned but can’t withdraw?
downline is 1 person and with me it would be two. and yea they charge u 5% processing fee, thats quite standard on credit cards isnt it? interest what u mean?
no they charge u 5% ( processing fee) to withdraw the profit you’ve made.
sorry wavseeker. there is no way that they have made that profit in that time. either you or your recruiter is lying.
nope i saw their e wallet. it said they had 4500 worth of panels and 2500 dollars total earnings in 3 motnhs. i saw it with my own eyes on their account and i saw the start of the traffic packs and it was three months ago. so they had to start from that date on.
what package did they start with?
i saw their e wallet. it said they had 4500 worth of panels and 2500 dollars total earnings in 3 motnhs. i saw it with my own eyes on their account and i saw the start of the traffic packs and it was three months ago. so they had to start from that date on.
they started with blue package
plus extra yellow panels as much as the rights permitted them
i think, im not sure that now they have 3 blues, about 9 purples and 21 yellows or something
Just to clarify, when you say ‘blue’ package, you mean the business package?
D. Pressed, what is wrong with you? Your statement (and you repeated it) was “I have no qualms about getting a refund via their stupidity/greed”, there you are INSULTING people who HAVE invested in BB. Or is calling someone stupid and/or greedy not an insult where you come from? Whether it be 2 years ago or 2 minutes ago it makes no difference, I didn’t say any time frame.
My assertion is that the fact that you can see that it is a fraud has been there from day one. There were glaring holes in the “business plan” that A LOT of people saw through (i know several who didn’t invest). One being why the hell do they need your money instead of going institutional? The other is that no matter what you are saying (you are lying by the way) it is only VERY recently that they have not been pitching it as a double your money scheme and if you are claiming otherwise then you are an out and out liar.
So let me ask you, what do you call a scheme that takes money from people who have hardly any and promises a double your money in less than 12 months with NO RISK (yes this was also always said up until very recently)????
You are in EXACTLY the same boat as those who invest today, and the most important information was readily available to you when you invested as it is today to them. Therefor if you call them stupid and greedy sir then I say that you are only talking about yourself.
Slightly off topic here, but still relevant, is anyone else having trouble getting on the Real Scam BB site? I have not been able to acess it all day, it seems to be blocked by Google as being able to damage my computer; and by my own computer as an “attack page” which sounds awful.
How very odd that suddenly one of the leading critics of BB has been effectively turned off! I hope that the problem will be resolved soon. I mean, that is a useful source of information after all.
Oh, and dear Wavseeker, you may indeed be seeing people making money – well, they say so, but please remember it isn’t real money until you hold it in your hand. And please think how these people have made that money. Money can be made lots of different ways and not all of them are legitimate. Personally, I think there is no substitute for money honestly earned by your own hard work.
I don’t believe in fairies and I certainly don’t believe that money is easily made from clicking on a few coloured panels on a website.
Also,
Being in the business or not is in no way relevant to how I saw this was fraud from the moment I heard about it.
Being in the business only allows us to PROVE it to people who couldn’t see if before they invested. Once people invest in a scheme like this you need to show them in black and white the glaring holes and even then a lot of the time they can’t accept it as accepting that they have been duped means accepting that they may not be as clever or on the ball as they once thought.
(wavseeker runs off to try and tweak his story…)
Actually wavseeker, I don’t have time to slowly draw you out. You are lying. The ‘blue’ package costs 145 dollars, not 500. And there is NO WAY that you can withdraw 1200 dollars after 3 months from a 500 dollar investment. Certainly not with a downline of 1 or 2.
Another BB liar trying to protect their investment by sucking more victims in.
Another liar who doesn’t have enough brains to at least make the lie somewhat believeable.
no i stick to my story 🙂 and i am not lying at all. i saw the ewallet. ive seen money coming from BB and thats why i invested in BB myself. i am not saying it is a scam, i am saying that IN CASE it is a scam my investment is safe. i am not going to discuss the fact whether you believe me or not, that is pointless. i am only telling you what ive seen with my own eyes, and if you want to judge that, thats fine.
no they invested into more yellows and also its calculated from euros to dollars and administrative costs and trafficing packs included for the first three months. for example ive bought a purple package with 2 months administrative fees and a three months traffic package. that costed me 258 euros
Thats fine wavseeker. Everyone can see you are lying. If anyone looks up the price of a blue package they can see you are lying.
You should at least have made it a bit of a challenge to figure out you were making it up 🙂
doesn’t matter if its euros or dollars. you said they invested 500 DOLLARS and that it was a blue package. the blue package costs 145 DOLLARS.
hahah lol i know a blue package is 145 dollars… lol… lemme tell you what ive invested because if you dont have the money to pay for adminstrative fees and traffic packages u are basically wasting 145 dollars. i invested 258 dollars which include 10 yellow panels, 3 purple ( purple package plus included loose panels, first 2 months of traffic costs and 3 months of administrative fees. all that together is 343 dollars minus fees
my upline invested more then 500 dollars and they bought a blue package and bought extra panels with the profit theyve already made.
It doesn’t matter what you invested. You have not got a penny back. We were discussing your claim of what your upline has made. Your claim is not true.
you make a profit every month you know. i dont have to invest any more money into traffic packages or worry about administrative costs because the profit i make from the panels i have is enough to cover the costs permanently. so basically is a smart start.
You haven’t made a profit. Numbers on a screen are not a profit…
like i said. i do not claim anything. i saw their ewallet which clearly showed the total worth of the panels to be 4500 dollars and their earned profit untill now was 2400 dollars. with an investment over those three months of 500 dollars and the profit of the panels put back into new panels. i assume you know how the system works, cuz every panel brings profit at the end of its run…
my upline withdrawed money from the bank…
when u set a panel to be 50% it gives u 1 new panel and 10 dollars( in case of a yellow) that 10 dollars u can again invet back into a new yellow panel.
but ive made my point in saying that ive seen people actually withdrawing money with their BB card. SEEN… so either their bank is giving them money that doesnt exist oooorrr BB actually paid them!! well i know enough. you know just write a book about BB and make it as interesting as u can, maybe u can promote it thru this site and actually make a profit that way 🙂 i wouldnt mind at all actually, money is money like i said. and i will see when i get my BB card if i can withraw money from the bank or not. if not then well lesson learned and if i can well then ive proven u wrong, but then again like i said. ive seen people getting money from the bank with their BB credit card
So now you are saying the 1200 figure is in the total earnings section of their ewallet?
Looks like we are never going to get the story straight. Bottom line is, you are lying about what profit they have made.
Lets be honest, anyone putting money into BB at this stage might as well flush it down the toilet.
no their earnings in their ewallet are 2400 dollars and theyve withrawn half of that
right in their hands. not in the toilet…
i was just on the phone with them and they have 12 downlines. i understood 2 but it was 12. srry about that misunderstanding.
the numbers don’t add up wav.
the downline of 12 does help somewhat but the figures still don’t add up.
Just as an aside, do you think you will be able to find 12 people to go in under you this late in the game?
yea sure i live in belgium so BB isnt really known here i guess 🙂 ive already got 5 or 6 potential people that wanna know more about it. and one good friend of mine already subscribed so. mm ill give u an update of the total of panels that they have maybe itll make more sense then. i also believe they needed two traffic packages or something and they have a premium account. and euro dollars valuta exchange changes up a few things as well i guess
Small bit of advice, I have been doing these cyclers for years. When the payments are slowing, and in some cases stopped, its time to jump ship. BB is on its last legs.
Don’t recruit people at this late stage. Especially friends. Otherwise they won’t be friends for long.
well can be but if i get back my original investment back i dont care if BB is on its last legs… more so, i dont even care if i lose my investment cuz actually it was worth it :p money is money its not that big of a deal. u dont invest money into something when u dont have an extra on the side. its money i can afford to lose but i doubt ill lose it. btw my upline said he had never known anybody that didnt get paid out by BB in the three months that they have been with BB. and there upline lives from the profit he gets from BB and travel to put up offices all over the world. and i know my upline personally. they are good friends so why would they be lying. everybody handles in good trust. well there isnt any reason not to trust BB because we all get our money… well we over here do. maybe the US part of BB is fucking up lol cuz in europe things are going smooth :p
Things in europe are not going smooth. You are getting really bad information. What offices are you talking about? Those offices don’t exist. Have you not read this blog??
dont exist yet, they are being put up as we speak srry. well the information im getting is apparently coming from the people that are actually doing it. cuz im on skype with my upline right now… smaller offices in countries in europe, my upline will ask him in what countries when he sees him. so ill relay that back to you as soon as i hear the info. and that will be the correct info
Seeing as he is online right now, ask him two questions:
1) What is the address of these supposed offices?
2) What is the name of his upline that is ‘going all over the world setting up offices’?
In fact, it would be much easier if he just came on to this blog and he could answer the questions himself.
and im getting bad info? lol im seeing it with my own eyes. the money is coming, BB is giving people over here their profit and as far as i know my upline his upline is living off of it and is setting up offices in european countries. why in godsname would they lie about it. u know what ill ask for pictures 😉 or wait thats not enough… the only proof i can give u is that ive seen people get actual cash in their hands with their BB card. that says enough lol who cares that offices dont exist or whether they are being set up or not. people over here, people that i know are getting their money/ profit, that says it all. that is some good info right there :p
So now you are back tracking and saying the offices don’t exist…
You really need to get your story straight.
You have offered to show us pictures; pictures and an address would be great. When can we have them?
no, hes too busy earning money from BB :p lol neeh im joking. actually he is too positive that he doenst want to come in contact with people that are negative.. and you know what hes right. i dont need people to tell me if BB is a scam or not… ill experience things first hand. and ill get back to this forum and post if indeed BB is a scam or not. if i get my money then BB is not a scam and ill post this. if i dont then u were right and BB was a scam, but at least ive learned a lesson. but as things are looking good for the moment here. people are getting their money and i have no worries whatsoever right now 🙂 so cheers and good luck
People are not getting their money. I am in BB alot longer than you and I can’t get money out. Neither can anyone elase in my group, including my upline.
This cycler is cooked. Wow you really fell for the sales pitch!
ill get back to u with the countries hes setting up offices in and his name 🙂
how long have you been in BB?
they didnt sell me anything. i chose to invest. i decided. my upline just explained and answered my questions.
how long as it been since uve asked for ur money btw?
@waveseeker
You keep calling it an investment. Is investment not a word on the list of words that BB affiliates cannot use, along with Master Card, Debit Card, Mature Panel(s), Online Advertising Company?
And no your investment is not safe if you can’t withdraw the funds.It’s not safe until it’s in your bank account.
Over a year.
Over two months
By the way, be careful using the investment word. BB are always looking for ways to shut down accounts, and that is a big no-no.
well that upline of my upline is in BB for a year and a half now. did u make a profit with BB since uve started?
I would have broke even if I got my last payment.
lol more then a year and u havent broke even??? how come?
Actually thats not quite true. I have 2 people in my downline. I always guarantee my immediate downline’s investments and they are not profitable yet. they can’t get paid either. I will pay what ever they have lost.
Al Capone was caught out for tax fiddling.
BB must? pay out with proper paperwork for the authorities , they do not.
There is an outfit in the UK , looking like an “Official” BB presence.
It has a proper address and registered (4/4/2012 ) business =
Domain name:
bbdealer.co.uk
Registrant:
JS Solutions
Registrant type:
UK Limited Company, (Company number: 7642098)
Registrant’s address:
Holcot
Thistle Down Barn
Sywell
NN6 0BG
United Kingdom.
A visit to the companies register will be most interesting.
weird that u cant get paid and my uplines can get paid… weird actually
Weird that 1,000s can’t get paid but your uplines are…
Just have a look at MMG. You don’t have to take my word for it.
MMG?
this forum is actually quite funny 🙂 1000s :p hahah whoooeeehh what is your point… ive already done the investment :p its too late bro :pthis quate maybe be applicable to u: “grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and wisdom to know the difference.” be a wise man… dont try to change things u cant change
Can I ask why you came on this blog?
because ive invested in BB and i wanted to be a positive touch in this forum cuz everyone is so negative and thats not a objective view. we have to balance the positive and negative comments 🙂
So everyone is negative yet you still think you can make money at this stage?
Have a look at MMG if you think here is negative.
Actually, have a look at realscam, now that thread will scare the pants off you.
By the way, Did you read the Q & A session with Terry?
yup read it. and this site is in itself not objective… the page itself demands that u are not objective 🙂 if it says scam then people who come on here will indeed confirm it is a scam. DUH they will… ever heard of pavlov?? if u give a dog food and ring a bell the dog associates food with that bell. if u get a theory ull automatically find facts that prove your theory so i dont need to be scared by sites that arent objective in the first place… of course there will always be scary things… oh hell in a 100 years we’ll all be dead… im just saying BB is an amzing company (scam or not) just because i am a positive kinda guy 🙂
always look on the bright side of life tadaadadada whistle whistle. chill out man 🙂
Forgive me if I am wrong here, Wavseeker, but how old are you?
Under 25? Under 20 maybe?
Just curious because you seem to have the irrepressible optimism of youth.
Terry, is working for BB. He was given ample time and opportunity to answer the questions. Of course all he had was lies and half truths.
Bit of advice for you, when you don’t bother doing DD before you invest(there’s that word again!), don’t bother doing it afterwards as you probably won’t like what you find.
He’s just trolling Della. I’m just in the humour to let him take all the rope he needs. Hopefully he has already turned plenty people off.
im not trolling :)im just telling people over here get their money and you are lying based on some sites… where are the offices of those sites huh, whos info is that? false info. and whoever told you they didnt get paid is giving you false info! you are a liar 🙂 lol lets go that way: yea telling each other we are liars :p that is awesome 🙂 i am older then 30, thats for sure and i have had my share of pyramid and ponzi schemes and i did my research and BB is certainly NOT one of those two
BBinsider – oh, so that’s what a troll does, is it?
Bit pathetic, isn’t it?
Well, you live and learn. I might be wrong of course, but I had him down as about 15 years old, if that.
A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.
Lying again. You say you know about pyramids/ponzis yet you don’t know what MMG is. Go on, wav, keep making a fool of yourself. There’s a big audience. lol
There he goes with the BB speak(or any ponzi speak).
They gave you a good brainwashing troll.
a troll is a troll. its that ugly thing from the LOTR if im not mistaken 🙂 ooh so negative della. why a bit pathetic, i am just laughing and putting myelf above all this negativity. i think i am the last person on here to be called pathetic :p and every label u put onto others is often a projection of your own personality. but its okay i understand the reaction and the judgement 😉 you know what the most funny thing is, i keep on responding cuz its quite enterteining to read all the responses :p
it sure is. especially when we know, that every sentence you write, turns more people off this scam.
tell us again about all the offices around the world…lol
ooh U mean a MLM. multi level marketing. yea i know that. say it right next time 🙂
hahah maybe if you took people more seriously people would actually believe you. but you yourself dont believe anything so why bother :p
and indeed people turn off this scam because that means more money for me :p
Nope, not MLM. I’m talking about MMG…
But you know all about MMG…with all your experience of ponzis…LOL.
Keep going, this is hilarious.
go on make me laugh harder 🙂
MMG is nowhere to be found on google so i guess ur lying :p we are so entertaining to one antoher. i am glad we can laugh about each others stupidity 😀
oh wait its the maybach music group LMAO
or is it the moneymakergroup
MMG isn’t on google? Really? Oh dear, you better go back and look again.
But you know all about ponzis…lol
He’s catching on folks!!
omg 2360 pages of complete BS :p
everything i read so far is a lie
Of course it is. Everyone is lying except you wav. Enjoy the read…
You can have the last word when I’m gone(its about all you have…lol)
and its not because u waste ur time on a forum with 2360 pages i should suddenly know it too. i know what a ponzi scheme is. wikipedia told me. and i know BB isnt a ponzi scheme
no i am lying too. about everything. we are all liars 🙂 now im pretending to be you, a pessimist. everyone is a liar and BB is a scam and everyone who tells me it is not is a liar. lol the funniest thing is you started with BB yourself…
if it was a scam and you did soo much research why did u started in the first place 🙂
ur contradicting yourself… u dug a hole for yourself and fell right into it… and now ur calling other people liars for a mistake YOU made in the first place… its like ur mad at people who stepped in the same shit u stepped in and trying to convince them it stinks. if people wanna put their foot in shit then let them put their foot into some shit, period… its none of your business what shit other people are stepping into. they will smell it eventually. no need to rub the shit in their face before they even stepped in it
and btw i will still have the money ive invested in BB back, so thats what i will have too 😀 (liar) lol like i said, and for everyone reading this post. my uplines are getting their money from BB and there is no need to worry.
I have been reading this discussion everyday and have learnt so much from it. I am one of the victim of BB scam. I have been waiting for my withdraw to be payment since Dec. 2012 and no payment received and no reply from BB either. I am intersted to know what is there in MMG. Can anyone tell me what is MMG stands for and what is the website address please! I really want to look what is happening there. Thanks.
TacticalNuclearPenguin (Junior Member @ realscam).
Firstly, … I don’t sleep well at the best of times… and seemed to be doing OK tonight.
Secondly, … my friend getting caught up in this. I don’t believe he has invested enough to ruin him…
Thirdly, and most importantly…
To each and every one of you who does the digging on scams like BB, THANK YOU. Your hard work is much appreciated!
TacticalNuclearPenguin (Junior Member @ realscam):
“The level of detail in some of the [realscam-] posts is remarkable and I can’t express how glad I am that I came here first!”
Realsscam, YEAH ! Plus the Finchman and others !
Nick:
I don’t dispute the ‘double your money’ point. It’s still being sold on that principle. That panels complete and you make 100% profit.
Doubling one’s mony is not, in itself, illegal or, necessarily implausible in business! If an entrepreneur is able to discover a niche or has a skill that is needed but for which there is little or no competition, then profit margins way in excess of 100% are feasible. I am not a liar. You have just misinterpreted my point. Again.
About 10 or 12 years ago I knew a bloke who worked in I.T. who was paid £100’s an HOUR to deal with computer problems at major companies, airport etc. At that time systems were less reliable and the people with the skills to sort the problems were in short supply. Nowadays the opposite is true, such that the going rate has plummeted and indeed many skilled I.T. people can’t get employment in I.T.!
The reason I distinguish between present affiliates and prospective ones is that we were sold the notion that BB was innovative and had created an unexploied niche market which brought advertisers, publishers and brokers under a cost efficient process. Money coming into the system was purported to from a variety of sources, including major manufactures, website owners, corporate investors and franchisees (or affiliates). The latter were important to the rapid growth of the model but were not the be all and end all…..At least that’s what we were told. Because the scheme was presented as revolutionary and cost effective (bringing advertisers, publishers and brokers under one umbrella), there was no absolute evidence to say what the profit margin could or couldn’t be.
Now the whole of BB’s assertions have been debunked, the model is a sham and most importantly, there is no money apart from the affiliate scheme. Which means it is NOT an innovative advertising network, but an unsustanable pyramid scheme.
I have never said we are blameless for getting into something we don’t really understand, but I think you’re the one insulting those of us who were admittedly naive, but were lied to. Because the scheme as described then had no direct competitor, there was no obvious reason to believe that doubling ones money legally and sustainably was completely implausible.
NOW, we no it is an utter sham, there is good reason to say that present affiliates are primarily victims whereas prospective affiliates are either deluded by the panel algorithm that presents virtual money as if it were real, or just plain foolish.
2011-12 affiliates were lied to from day one. 2013 prospective affiliates are being differently lied to, but have a raft of evidence available to them to KNOW that. Yes, we were naive to some extent then, but no more so than people who trusted the Government not to increase retirement age, or trusted high status companies not to detroy their pension annuities. Indeed, having been ripped off by the establishment, it’s unsurpising that many people (in their 50’s and 60’s) would place their trust in something which seemed revolutionary and viable given the vast power that the internet has acquired in a short timescale as a place to do business. The potential for a model such that BB presented seemed immense and workable IF all the core elements existed and so-ordinated in the manner we were led to believe. Sadly they don’t exist, so the dream turns into a nightmare for those who have plunged redundacy money or savings in the hope it would lead to a viable retirement.
People like Wavrider, who still choose to ignore all of the proof that there is no network, there are no advertisers, who choose to ignore the Q and A between Finch and Terry which only points to one conclusion, choose to ignore the many people on here who have related their appalling expereinces within BB…..They deserve to lose their money. That is why I have no sympathy/empathy for them.
As regards the likes of myself and Finch’s mum, we are guility of naivity, and but we were not motivated by anything other than the desire to generate some extra LEGAL income to make up for some of the losses we’ve incurred through no fault of our own via the incompetence and lies of successive Governments and supposedly highly reputable and trustworthy employers.
If we knew when we signed up what we know now then WE would be either stupid or greedy or both, but when you’re mis-sold a scheme (as Terry admitted) there is a defence which makes us primarily victims of conmen and partly victims of our own gullibility/ignorance.
Therefore, it’s actually you who insults people who have lost money. I omly insult (or have no respect for) people who haven’t lost money, but seem only too willing to do so and, in doing so, help prop up a Ponzi. Or, like wavrider, consider optimism to be a greater attribute than reality when deciding whether to join BB. Despite there is ample evidence from affiliates AND impartial experts that what we bought into was a pack of lies.
Experience is the factor that wasn’t available a year ago. Evidence such as we have now genuinely was not available this time last year, because the problems didn’t become apparant until the latter part of the year with the lack of support, slow to no payments, and the technical proof that Finch provided to show the network we were told was massive was in fact just a few junk websites owned by BB and a load of affiliates financing an empty vessel.
My point was never about justifying my mistakes, but about putting into context why getting a refund is not a bad thing to do, if one can. Even though we know that money has to come from new affiliates. It is not a licence to get a Vector card and draw out as much as we can because ethat would be greedy and foolish, but simply to get back what has been lost and no more. And to consider that if people still choose to buy into BB at this stage of the game they really have no one to blame but themselves and therefore really deserve no sympathy or respect.
Even you should acknowledge that point, because how much evidence fo people need, both factual and anecdotal, to forget emotion and get their brains in gear!
wavseeker says:
February 4, 2013 at 4:22 pm
and btw i will still have the money ive invested in BB back, so thats what i will have too (liar) lol like i said, and for everyone reading this post. my uplines are getting their money from BB and there is no need to worry.
Opmtimists never worry. Pessimists worry all the time. Realists worry for a while then accept the truth and stop worrying. Some of them then go out of their way to try and help optimists and pessimists to become realists, but neither group wants to listen. So the realist decides that an optimist is his best chance of achieving parity. 😉
Adreasheinz: Why on earth are you quoting the banal comments of a junior member of another forum? If he has a point to make here then let him do so. I suppose at least it’s more coherent than the bizarre drivel you spout, but that in itself, is not justification for either his or your existence.
Wav: my you went off on one after I left. Don’t worry…the ranting and raving didn’t look that bad 🙂
Still claiming that I am a liar and MMG doesn’t exist?
Still claiming that everyone on MMG is lying and you are the only one telling the truth?
Any update on all the offices around the world?
Come on Wav, where are the pictures and address?
BB is probably partying at the moment!
realscam no longer shows up on the first google results page!
Did BB plant malware on realscam ? E.g. by joining their forum and linking to badware sites ? realscam is no longer on the first page of the google searchterm for ‘banners broker’, and when trying to go directly to realscam, I got a google alert that realscam is infected.
So that probably resulted in a blacklist and/or lower result priority, so realscam no longer shows up.
User complaints all over Facebook, even starting to clog up the official BB page.
BB has managed to survive longer than many of us thought. But when thousands of members have no withdrawal option available, can you really say that a program is still alive?
It seems to me that BB hit ‘the wall’ in Mid-December. Personally, I don’t see things getting any better. Expect some sporadic payments for the referral rainmakers, but at the expense of other pending withdrawals (at this point, pretty much everybody who was using STP/Payza).
They can no longer pay out using fresh money from new members, so they’re using the money they already owe to smaller fish investors, and paying it to bigger investors. It’s a vicious cycle of increasing their ‘debt’ while alienating even more of their members.
@wavseeker
“i know what a ponzi scheme is. wikipedia told me. and i know BB isnt a ponzi scheme”
OK let’s see what wikipedia says:
“A Ponzi scheme is a fraudulent investment operation that pays returns to its investors from their own money or the money paid by subsequent investors, rather than from profit earned by the individual or organization running the operation. ”
There you have it. BB clearly gets the majority, well over 75%, (based on the revenue claimed by BB) of their funds from new signups and from existing members in the various fees they must pay.
D. Pressed, please name to me any program past or present that can or has promised double your money within 12 months and sells directly to retail investors and made good on their claims without any risk.
You can’t because it doesn’t exist, it’s a pipe dream.
No matter how the offer was pitched it always fell flat on that reason.
Anything that could double your money no risk would be snapped up by trillions of dollars of institutional money at much lower cost to the genius behind it. In fact 10% no risk offer would have their hand chewed off by proper money.
You are naive and that’s why you entered the program. No shame in it as there are a lot more people out there who fell for this scam, but at least they don’t go around insulting others for doing EXACTLY THE SAME THING as them.
Just look at the claims being made by this UK BB affiliate:
1) Banners Broker is a recession proof business opportunity.
2) BB is a legitimate endorsed and working with Master Card.
3) The return of TWICE what you purchased.
4) Sit back and reap the rewards
5) 30 day, 100% money-back guarantee
6) There is NO limit to the potential earnings
http://bbdealer.co.uk/
I’m amazed that intelligent people fall for this, alarms bells should be ringing all over the place.
Amen Buzz.
@buzz
The majority of people falling for these schemes are the ones who least can afford it. They are looking for additional income and are grasping at “opportunities” that promise high return for little effort or time. The scammers are excellent at presentations and parading their top earners in front of audiences and spouting off how much they made in a short time. The more complex the scheme the easier it seems to be to con people.
The ones with substantial money that go in it are usually in at the beginning of the con knowing they will get theirs back in multiples with a ton of people in their downline at the expense of the ones getting in late, just before the inevitable shut down.
Like most, I’ve been reading various forums looking for reliable information one way or another on who Banners Broker is. What I’ve found is very little reliable information from the people posting on them.
You’re going to start calling me names, but it’s irrelevant since I don’t know you, but, when a person from the company comes here knowing they don’t have to, publicly tells you you have it wrong, explains how things actually work, and you call them a liar without proof…well, it says something about the people speaking here. You call it propaganda, society calls it ignorance.
From what I’ve read, none of you are willing to budge on your opinion, which best I can tell, is an uneducated and presumptuous one. You reject any explanation calling claims to having proof to the contrary, but fail to deliver any.
For someone looking for knowledge here, there just isn’t any, just a bunch of predators looking to damage a company’s reputation. IF you have proof Banners Broker isn’t who they claim to be, stop writing your opinions or thoughts, and post it. Give us links that demonstrate why you’re right. Link to articles that demonstrate the business model can’t work, or that they’re violating laws. You’re using circumstantial information and the past failures of others to draw conclusions on a company none of you really understand, because you aren’t listening. I’ve verified Terry Stern’s identity, actually spoke to him. I can’t do that with any of you, and am not interested in calling Finch. So who am I to believe? The guy who openly explains his client’s company, and takes the time to answer my questions, or trust the word of “Finch `n Friends” that can prove nothing?
I’m actually angry at the bunch of you for wasting my time. I did my research by looking over what Terry Stern said here and on realscam. If you factor in that the company has to purchase additional ad space and traffic for each affiliate that enters the company, ignore that they need to make a profit on everything, and look at what they return to the affiliate, then it’s easy to see, that the majority of the initial purchase from the affiliate actually goes back to the affiliate in the form of complimentary panels and the purchase value in their ewallet. I’ve confirmed this through contacting white label ad networks and inquiring about how their “unlimited reseller” program works as a potential reseller. After doing that research, which didn’t take that long may I add, my conclusion is, you so-called bunch of experts are actually presumptuous idiots.
I suggest you re-read what Terry Stern said, then actually use common sense to work things through. Every company out there that offers online affiliate programs has issues in paying every affiliate on time, even Google, and if you think Banners Broker is in the wrong for terminating accounts and keeping the revenues for breech, then you really aren’t as smart as you think. Google calls it suspended, but here’s a quote “You acknowledge that any attempted participation or violation of any of the foregoing is a material breach of this Agreement and that we may pursue any and all applicable legal and equitable remedies against You, including an immediate suspension of Your account or termination of this Agreement, and the pursuit of all available civil or criminal remedies. ” which you can find here https://www.google.com/adsense/localized-terms?rc=TL If you don’t like the company’s policies, don’t join. If you aren’t using support to get answers, then that’s on you. Quit making excuses why you’re failing and blaming the company to make yourself feel better.
My suggestion to anyone that’s really interested in finding answers about Banners Broker, read what’s been said carefully. There are plenty of occasions where people misquote and claim one person said A, when they clearly said B. The people here had an opportunity to know what’s really going on with BB, and no-one here wanted to hear it.
My suggestion, actually do some research. Stuff posted on sites like this is only intended to do one thing, cause doubt and mislead you. They don’t want you to know the truth, because it doesn’t do them any good to provide it to you.
Remember: Never argue with an idiot, they’ll drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience.
For the record, I’m one of those ‘retired’ people you claim BB preys on, with over 40 years business industry experience. My opinion is, that the evidence clearly shows Banners Broker to be a solid opportunity, but draw your own conclusion from actual research, not hearsay or opinions.
I don’t have to justify myself to you Nick, even though I’ve tried REALLY hard rto counter your absuive, baseless accusations. I did not and have not ‘insulted’ anyone who naively joined BB. You say I have. But not one person who is in the scheme and posts on here has told me I’ve insulted them.
I empathise and sympahise with them. Yes, I’m surprised that Finch’s mum got involved without asking her son what he thought, but regardless, I firmly believe she was duped in the same way as the rest of us, so I hope she gets redress. Although that’s looking extremely unlikely.
I have made it clear how our collective naivity can be explained, (not exhonerated, but explained). I explained how it was feasible to think it might work on the basis of the evidence we were presented with. I also explained that if something has not been done before, it doesn’t necessarily prove it can’t if the model is presented plausibly. And it’s all very well for you to ponificate about how you knew straight away, but that’s partly because you claim to have expertise in the ‘industry’. If the model was so transparently absurd as you claim, then there is no way that BB would have nearly 300,000 paid up members! That’s an awful lot of people to be drawn in by a blatant con! That’s because at that time, it was subtle and plausible.
Therefore finding or not finding another business idea/investment (whatever you want to call it) on the internet, is irrelevant. I am entirely in agreement with Buzz, but an intelligent person looking at the evidence now MUST conclude that the model and the claims are ludicrous and unsubstantiated. A year ago they were unsubstantiated and highly optimistic, but there was no proof that it was ludicrous and no proof that the network BB claimed to be building wasn’t being built.
I also made it clear there is a huge difference between naivity and greed. The insult you claim I made is based around the notion that the earlier BB affiliates were greedy/stupid except me! That somehow I was claiming to be merely naive! That would be utter nonsense if it was what I’d stated, but it clearly IS NOT. We were all naive, but regardless of intelligence, we were far more open to being conned through lack of hard facts than anyone is now. In fact, anyone as from about last October has been able to make a much more common sense/reality check decision based on what was not delivered by BB, rather than what we were told would be.
I clarified my position by stating that naivity is no longer an excuse for anyone still considering whether or not to join BB NOW or in the FUTURE. Therefore, their motivation must be different, yet is inexplicable given the mountains of evidence piling up by the day. Finch has mentioned the growing swell of frustration and anger which is, hopefully, the beginning of the end of this sorry affair.
I can’t make it any clearer than that, because there is no contradiction in those statements. If you can’t get whose side I’m on as an affiliate, or still wish to twist my truth into your accusations, then so be it.
If ANYONE who is actually in BB as an affiliate, wishes to attack or defend my stance, via a reasoned critique then I welcome them to do so. If any affilaite feels I have insulted them and can explain how, then I will willingly apologise. Including Finch’s mum if she wishes to have a go at me! That was certainly not my intent and I do not believe it comes over that way to anyone who reads the post in context of past and present knowledge.
Conversely. If anyone reads this who is not in BB but is considering joining it. PLEASE look at the FACTS as they are NOW and and kindly explain on what possible grounds you can justify it.
C.Grant – “Like most, I’ve been reading various forums looking for reliable information one way or another on who Banners Broker is. What I’ve found is very little reliable information from the people posting on them.”
—
How would you describe the information provided by existing BB affiliates? Are those dubious affiliate websites more trustworthy in your opinion? You know, the ones where the affiliates have a vested financial interest in what they post about?
—
“You’re going to start calling me names, but it’s irrelevant since I don’t know you, but, when a person from the company comes here knowing they don’t have to, publicly tells you you have it wrong, explains how things actually work, and you call them a liar without proof…well, it says something about the people speaking here. You call it propaganda, society calls it ignorance.”
—
Did you read the Q&A?
I didn’t call Terry a liar. I disputed his ‘facts’ with facts that exist in the real world. You are welcome to assume that I think he’s a liar, because I do. But let’s not forget about his 18 ‘no comments’.
—
“From what I’ve read, none of you are willing to budge on your opinion, which best I can tell, is an uneducated and presumptuous one. You reject any explanation calling claims to having proof to the contrary, but fail to deliver any.”
—
This is like a Religion vs. Science argument. The people scrutinising BannersBroker are doing so with facts and universal standards. The people backing BannersBroker are doing so with blind faith, swallowing whatever gospel is thrown their way.
I won’t budge from my opinion until the evidence demands it. As for uneducated opinions, I wasn’t the one answering questions with “No comment”. At least I had the balls to provide one.
—
“For someone looking for knowledge here, there just isn’t any, just a bunch of predators looking to damage a company’s reputation. IF you have proof Banners Broker isn’t who they claim to be, stop writing your opinions or thoughts, and post it. Give us links that demonstrate why you’re right. Link to articles that demonstrate the business model can’t work, or that they’re violating laws. You’re using circumstantial information and the past failures of others to draw conclusions on a company none of you really understand, because you aren’t listening. I’ve verified Terry Stern’s identity, actually spoke to him. I can’t do that with any of you, and am not interested in calling Finch. So who am I to believe? The guy who openly explains his client’s company, and takes the time to answer my questions, or trust the word of “Finch `n Friends” that can prove nothing?”
—
Look above your head. Whistling straight past it you’ll find the bleeding obvious, serenaded by the fat lady singing. If you can’t grasp the evidence that has already been put forward, then that’s your problem.
You’re welcome to disagree with it. That’s the beauty of the Internet.
I don’t personally understand why you’d waste your time coming here to disagree with my opinions. If BannersBroker is legitimate, and I am the mere bastard child, then why waste your time arguing with me? Go and make your money, live happily ever after, and enjoy the life-changing riches that BannersBroker offers.
I’ve yet to hear a response from a single BB apologist about why I’m worth arguing with. If I’m wrong, and BB doesn’t rely on new members, then why even bother arguing? I can only harm their business if I’m right.
—
“I’m actually angry at the bunch of you for wasting my time. I did my research by looking over what Terry Stern said here and on realscam. If you factor in that the company has to purchase additional ad space and traffic for each affiliate that enters the company, ignore that they need to make a profit on everything, and look at what they return to the affiliate, then it’s easy to see, that the majority of the initial purchase from the affiliate actually goes back to the affiliate in the form of complimentary panels and the purchase value in their ewallet. I’ve confirmed this through contacting white label ad networks and inquiring about how their “unlimited reseller” program works as a potential reseller. After doing that research, which didn’t take that long may I add, my conclusion is, you so-called bunch of experts are actually presumptuous idiots.”
—
Really? Tell me which white label ad networks you’ve contacted and we’ll compare evidence.
—
“I suggest you re-read what Terry Stern said, then actually use common sense to work things through. Every company out there that offers online affiliate programs has issues in paying every affiliate on time, even Google”
—
Are you Terry in disguise? You’re both using the same browser, on the same OS, through the same ISP, in Ontario. It wouldn’t surprise me.
For what it’s worth, every company does not have ‘payment problems like BannersBroker’. I work with various affiliate networks that wire me much more than the average BB affiliate receives. I receive the payments on-time, every week, and if they’re more than 12 hours later, then I consider that a problem. Banners Broker on the other hand? It sounds like most affiliates are still chasing payments from 2012!
You can try to pass it off as an industry standard. I’d have to question which other shambolic companies you’ve been working with to come to such a belief.
—
“…and if you think Banners Broker is in the wrong for terminating accounts and keeping the revenues for breech, then you really aren’t as smart as you think. Google calls it suspended, but here’s a quote “You acknowledge that any attempted participation or violation of any of the foregoing is a material breach of this Agreement and that we may pursue any and all applicable legal and equitable remedies against You, including an immediate suspension of Your account or termination of this Agreement, and the pursuit of all available civil or criminal remedies. ” which you can find here https://www.google.com/adsense/localized-terms?rc=TL If you don’t like the company’s policies, don’t join. If you aren’t using support to get answers, then that’s on you. Quit making excuses why you’re failing and blaming the company to make yourself feel better.”
—
Show me one instance where a Google AdWords customer has been banned for questioning Google, or for posting a negative comment about them.
Does it not strike you as strange that on the BannersBroker official Facebook page, there are status updates listed with over 70 comments, but when you click to read them you can only find 20? That’s epic censorship.
Ever seen Google attempt to silence over half of its customers?
—
“My suggestion to anyone that’s really interested in finding answers about Banners Broker, read what’s been said carefully. There are plenty of occasions where people misquote and claim one person said A, when they clearly said B. The people here had an opportunity to know what’s really going on with BB, and no-one here wanted to hear it.”
—
Is that because nobody wanted to hear it or because nobody could hear it? I can’t misquote somebody who answers with ‘no comment’.
—
“My suggestion, actually do some research. Stuff posted on sites like this is only intended to do one thing, cause doubt and mislead you. They don’t want you to know the truth, because it doesn’t do them any good to provide it to you.”
—
WHY?
Why would I spend so many hours attempting to obfuscate the ‘truth’? What do I possibly gain by doing so?
You sound like a whacko conspiracy theorist with logic like this.
If BannersBroker was a legitimate company, I would change my tune, insert a referral link, and make a fortune from a huge downline. Your argument that it doesn’t suit me to say positive things about BannersBroker is just completely irrational.
—
“For the record, I’m one of those ‘retired’ people you claim BB preys on, with over 40 years business industry experience. My opinion is, that the evidence clearly shows Banners Broker to be a solid opportunity, but draw your own conclusion from actual research, not hearsay or opinions.”
—
You voice your opinion then you tell people that they shouldn’t trust opinions.
That’s absolutely correct, and it puts you in the same league as me. I’ve voiced my opinions, explained them as best as I can, and the rest is up to the reader.
I’m not sure what ‘business industry experience’ amounts to, but I’m pretty sure you’ll soon look back on this venture as one of the damper squibs. That’s just my opinion.
Sthe the person defending Terry, is doing so from the same computer as Terry? Haha. Thats priceless 🙂
No… well it might be the same computer, but it’s a different IP.
We’ll assume it’s not Terry. But he clearly has at least ONE fan in Ontario.
Question finch: have they now officially stopped paying through stp & payza?
Speaks volumes that people who are still actively involved in BB appear on here to get up-to-date information, ie the truth, about the scheme. Just my opinion and I look forward to being shot down for that.
DD
BBinsider – Tough to say. I’ve seen a few reports of <$200 payments. Nothing substantial, and lots of complaints.Some interesting developments from last week...David Hooker has been flat-out lying about me at the recent UK events:This from one of my sources who at the West Bromwich event:"You may or may not be pleased to know that you were personally mentioned by David Hooker I believe his name is, their Compliance Director, he advised us to ignore your blog, I think they are trying to pre-empt the fact that people will try and do research. They also interestingly claimed that your wife is a Banners Broker Affiliate. I somehow doubt that is true, but I think you should be aware that that is what they are claiming.""It was your wife he said, he implied you had her join in order to try and drive revenue from banner advertising on your own site higher. The manner in which it was said was just outright nasty."My 'wife' (who is actually my fiancé) has never been a part of BannersBroker, and she hates the company even more than I do.Pretty funny how the Chief Director of Compliance is caught with his pants down making wholly inaccurate claims that might be considered slanderous...When I confronted Terry Stern over this lack of compliance with the truth from BB's leading compliance officer, I received this:"I've spoken to Mr. Hooker regarding this matter, and he's clearly stated that he, like any company, advised our affiliates against getting caught up in the inaccurate and misleading information that these blogs are putting out there. As far as stating your wife being an affiliate, he may have mis-spoken when referring to your mother, however, this is public information as you've posted it on your site as well, and what he sated was that bloggers use the negative press and controversy to drive traffic to their websites to sell their products, which is also true in many cases."I'm not sure if this counts as an apology?What does 'mis-spoken' mean?Is that ponzi speak for 'I lied and got found out'?
Nope, you are right. I can’t get an answer from support. And when I ask any question on BB sites, it is either removed are I get fields of abuse.
David Hooker, in his own words:
If you’re reading this David, I hope you realise Post #4 on BannersBroker is going to be devoted entirely to you, and ensuring you have no career left when this scheme unravels.
I’m not going to post it today, or tomorrow.
I’m going to wait until BannersBroker is officially dead in the water. That way I can call you exactly what you deserve to be called, without a single shill or troll left to defend you.
In the meantime, think twice before fabricating lies about me, or my partner. And try not to be so fucking dumb in how you spread them.
Spouting slander to a room of ‘believers’, some of whom have recording devices reporting back to me directly, is no way for a Chief Compliance Director to behave. I’ll be listening to your future presentations very carefully.
Have a nice day 🙂
PS. The most inspirational speaker in the world?
Where can I find you on TED talks? Under ‘Slander’?
If Wavseeker didnt need to look up wikipedia to see what a Ponzi Scheme is…………………
As far as I know he used to work for Herbalife. An MLM in serious trouble at the moment. Just look at the share price.
Yep, and they’re in trouble because they’ve been accused of… pyramid trading.
Would love to know why he is no longer with HLF…
rofl …… seems BB are doing there best to proove THEY ARE A PONZI …. sorry how stupid can you be to tell such lies in a meeting and not expecting that it could come back to them ….. ah but they realy believ they have a room full of sheeps that will believe anything they say …..
am hoping waverider pops by again …. am pretty sure i know his upline reading his comments he is in for a big surprise 🙂 the figures on the screen means nothing but you can’t get them to understand that it seems 🙂
kind regards
brenie
Just a suggestion Finch bt you should think about having an award for the stupidest, obviously fake, testimonials. Wav would definitely be up there at the moment…
Your blog and sites like RealScam are certainly of concern to the BB true believers. Got them in a fair old tizz, it has.
One of my favourite affiliate sites – favourite because it is in the realms of “so bad it’s good” – has now got a section added to it which used to be called “For the sceptics” and is now called “The scamming world” – a bit of a Fruedian slip there, I think. This section is basically about nasty, naughty blogs like this one, and how there is:-
” a whole industry out there in the negative blogging (or scamming) world. They make money by attracting people to their sites, on which they have adverts. The more people who come, the more clicks they get and the more money they make. In reality they make their money by running down often perfectly legal operations. Some of their information may be loosely based on some sort of fact, but then it is generally twisted to give a negative impression. These sites often live on just the right side of legality, but sometimes not. And, of course, the more people who view them the further up the viewing tree these sites go. Given that many people seem to relish finding negative information, even when there is so much good information around, these sites lead a pretty healthy (sic!) existence.
Probably the best analogy is that the scamming sites are parasitical because they live on the basis of drawing on the life blood of others and, if they do manage to kill off one host site, they just go and find another one”
This character does not seem to realise what he has written could equally well be applied to other things, does he?
He then repeats the story that apparently Mr Hooker told about being contacted by:-
“two key negative scammers” [who are named in the article but I have removed their names in this quote] and asked them to come and see BB for themselves, he offered to pay for their flights and accommodation, and to come and spend some time in BB HQ. Guess what? They said YES , but then said they would charge a consultancy fee, around $900; to write nice things about BB! You can imagine Banners Broker’s response to that one”
These people really should be careful what they say when people out there read it and take screen shots, shouldn’t they?
Sorry, I meant Freudian slip – typo!
BB took $100 premium member fees from me two weeks ago without any notice. Then took further $35 BB prepaid card shipping fees from again after I had paid the shipping fees 4 month ago. Yesterday BB steal $100 from my eWallet without any explanation. I have 3 withdrawals pending The longest waiting time has been 40 days now.
They are getting desperate.
I tried a while ago to find David Hookers TV show without much success. There was a show but I couldn’t tell if it was a proper Tv one or just one of the low ranked cable station offering. If someone oiks provide a clip that would be good (for a laugh, I am sure)
C Grant. I won’t bother expanding on Finch’s destruction of your case except to say that, if YOU read through Terry Stern’s attempts to justify BB’s existence on here; you’ll notice that he was in to name calling, sarcasm and accusing people of telling lies without proof.
I call Terry propaganda, I call Terry ignorant. His explanation of how BB ‘works’ was an insult to my intelligence. He evaded or refused to answer any specific questions. He definitely lied when trying to defend the alleged necessity for photo. ID. He lied about why BB didn’t use Paypal. He lied about the processing (or lack of processing) of payments via STP. Those are just the LIES he told in response to my posts a few others. When he wasn’t lying, all he had to say was ‘no comment’.
As for David Hooker… ‘The most inspirational and thought provoking speaker in the world today’….F’k me…. This must be the most outrageous misrepresentation to date! A man that arrogant cannot possibly be taken seriously by anyone with an IQ higher than 12. You ask for proof BB is a scam…and have been given plenty, yet Hookface-Fuckface makes claims about himself which could not possibly pass even the most rudimentary credibility test and is roundly supported by BBI as their man on a mission. That in itself is ‘red flag’ material.
Let’s get this in perspective in terms of what he says about himself:
There are nearly seven BILLION people living on planet earth today. And he puts himself above every, single, ruddy one of them! 😮
Could you ask Mr Hooker-Fooker to provide PROOF that he is the one man pyramid he asserts himself to be? For I fear, that if what he claims is true, and he were to fall under a tram tomorrow, there would be no hope for humanity. 🙁
P.S. I could have gone to the West Bromwich event if I’d known about it. Where do they publish the information for upcoming events?
Secondly, why are you and your reporters merely ‘listening’ to presentations? There has been too much internet talk and not enough real-world action. Why was nobody kicking up a fuss? Challenging?, questioning? provoking? If I’d have been there I’d definitely have shouted up and told him to retract that statement. Amongst other things…..
I want to go to an open event for prospective affiliates to spread the negativity, aka the TRUTH about BB; and wipe that arse-licker’s grin off Hooker’s one in seven billion face.
@ Roth
“BB took $100 premium member fees from me two weeks ago without any notice. Then took further $35 BB prepaid card shipping fees from again after I had paid the shipping fees 4 month ago. Yesterday BB steal $100 from my eWallet without any explanation. I have 3 withdrawals pending The longest waiting time has been 40 days now.”
As TEFLON TERRY put it: YOU DO NEED A STRATEGY
– panel speed down
– the “real” account out of balance +30days
– TPs / terminated
– bonus sucked
– that way ALL YOUR PANELS SUCKED
RE TPs terminated is ALL panels terminated…sooo sorry to say.
@ d.predded
as for the TNPs (tactical nuclear penguins)
– duck and cover
– run, runrunrun as fast as you can
– wash, washwashwash for the renaining nuclides
http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index319.html
@ Finch
“If I’m wrong, and BB doesn’t rely on new members, then why even bother arguing? I can only harm their business if I’m right.”
I think that’s the real point…
If I were Mr. Smith, Dixit or Stern and had 300,000 happy members on my *legitimate* BB program, I would never come here and argue with you all. I would probably issue a press release explaining why you’re telling lies, and then send my lawyers to kick your asses.
Exactly, Daniel.
The shills and trolls like to resort to personal attacks, or long-winded 4 page PDFs on why I’m not to be trusted. They fail to answer the more significant question:
Why the hell do they even care?
What difference does it make to them if a ‘negative blogger’ deters somebody else from joining the program?
The only explanation for their anger and contempt is that:
a) Their own profits are entwined with the company’s survival.
b) They see negative bloggers as a threat to new sign-ups.
c) They see new sign-ups as crucial to the company’s survival.
Which leads to my assumption that the anger and contempt is based on a belief that:
New sign-ups = fundamental to BannersBroker’s survival.
…an amusing paradox when you consider that every new affiliate BB takes onboard actually creates more debt that the company has to pay back by ‘doubling the return’.
If BB were legit, there would be no conversation.
This would be a bitter blog with zero comments, and David Hooker would not feel the need to tell crowds to ‘ignore me’, because I wouldn’t even be on the company’s radar (Except for maybe their legal team, who would have crucified me by now)
@C Grant
If you want to know if a product/business plan is a scam the last person you would go to confirm that would be the person selling it. What’s he going to say, yes it is a scam?
It is more logical to believe the people that can’t get their money out than to believe the ones that stole it.
Finch, funny you should say that. A BB’er sent me a link to “The laws of success” as proof that banner brokers was legit, I contacted the author (Al/Alan Baker). All he wanted to do was discredit you. Not sure Al is to be trusted though, he’s a creative writer, a BB affiliate and wants to promote traffic to his own site. He claims to be living in France with his horses and vineyard yet his phone number and website are both linked to an address in Detroit, USA.
@Phil Hendy
Here is David Cooker, the PR scammer 🙂 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsEisqweHU8 . We can all have a laugh at him.
I forget who said ‘the pimps and shills have gone very quiet’ etc, indicating assumptions that the end is nigh etc etc etc, not only on here, but on realscam also.
I find it astounding that from some of the points I’ve read, pretty much every single ‘BB apologist’ as Finch calls them, has been verbally abused by someone or other, and then people get all, whooo, it’s gone quiet, end must be near etc.
Honestly, are any of you surprised that people have shut up?
It doesn’t mean anything, other than the fact that they have finally realised that arguing with anyone on here, and anywhere else, is a complete waste of time and more often than not, they receive insults and bad language hurled at them.
I’ve had insults thrown at me and as I said previously, someone even cared to comment that they hope that I lose my life savings, nice chap! My initial argument was more about corruption within socially acceptable institutions, which by all accounts is universally accepted and completely ignored on here, yet valid discussion points I thought. Obviously not and goes to show that many people have no ability to actually reason with people or listen, instead they choose to insult and throw bad language around. Pathetic behaviour in my opinion.
How can you reason with unreasonable people? Impossible. Why bother? If I had the time and the inclination Finch, I could point out many errors through this entire article, the previous article and that you and many others have made vast assumptions, leading to blatant inaccuracies and really quite embarrassing schoolboy errors, taking things out of context and making badly informed conclusions based on the initial inaccuracies of said presumptions/assumptions. But I really can’t be arsed, it’d take far too long, esp for the end result to be on the receiving end of some form of abuse.
Also, I’m pretty sure everyone on here is an human, who has the right to be treated with respect, it appears that on many and most occasions, the insults have been thrown initially by those on the anti BB side, completely unprovoked.
I honestly do not know why I bothered writing all this, it is likened, in my mind to having your voice heard in the house of commons, or not rather, amidst all the jeering and pathetic schoolyard politics.
@Frank
“I’ve had insults thrown at me and as I said previously, someone even cared to comment that they hope that I lose my life savings,”
I doubt too many posters here want you to lose your life savings. Having said that, by joining the BB scam you are helping to defraud people by taking their money (maybe their life savings) in the hope that you don’t lose yours.
Why did you post here Frank?
@ Ken
I would like you to point out where I stated that I had joined BB. I haven’t commented on whether I was pro BB or anti BB, let alone being actively involved. I do know someone who is and that’s what peaked my interest and subsequently found this site and commented. On interpretation of my comments, assumptions were made and suddenly, according to Finch, I became a ‘BB apologist’ or whatever. I didn’t like his tone on a few posts, mentioned it and I’m pigeon holed.
And I disagree I’m afraid, I’m sure there are many on here who want to have a good laugh at people and their potential for misfortune, in whatever sphere. I just don’t get good vibes from many of the comments man. It’s as if people get a kick out of seeing people fail, makes them feel good inside or summit.
I also don’t get why people feel the need to ‘protect’ others. My mind keeps thinking of Dave Angel – Eco Warrior – Fast Show – but in this respect, in a people context, and really not very funny and offensive at times.
People should know that whatever choices they make are their own choices and should ultimately take responsibilty for their own decisions and actions. Sadly, this is often not the case and is reinforced by people ‘guiding’ others. This lessens the responbility side and only opens up avenues to blame and accuse others, whatever the outcome of said situation may be.
Frank – “People should know that whatever choices they make are their own choices and should ultimately take responsibilty for their own decisions and actions. Sadly, this is often not the case and is reinforced by people ‘guiding’ others. This lessens the responbility side and only opens up avenues to blame and accuse others, whatever the outcome of said situation may be.”
And how exactly do you think Banners Broker grew to 300,000 affiliates if not through the ‘guidance’ and manipulation of others? Give me a break.
There’s no harm in having two sides to an argument. Before these posts, the net was largely whitewashed with affiliates ‘guiding’ more affiliates in to their downlines. And you want to talk to me about freedom of choice?
Laughable, just laughable.
@ BBInsider
Honestly, I have no idea, I have a free afternoon, I’m a bit bored, fancied typing summit – what sort of answer are you looking for? If you let me know, maybe I can come up with an acceptable one?
Finch, if I remember correctly, back when you started this stuff, you commented on them having 160,000 affiliates. As you say above, they now apparently have 300,000. You have obviously done a great job, keep it up!
Frank – That was the ‘official number’ being rolled out by BannersBroker at the time. It’s not my fault that they can’t keep their numbers consistent.
When BannersBroker started this stuff, they were promoted as a ‘straightline cycler doubler’. Apparently, 18 months later they are a global advertising broker.
Consistencies and BannersBroker have always been a grey area.
Sorry, you were saying?
@Frank
“People should know that whatever choices they make are their own choices and should ultimately take responsibilty for their own decisions and actions.”
That’s fine if (and it’s a big IF) people make choices/decisions whatever you wish to call them from a position of having all the facts/evidence etc in front of them. I respectfully disagree with most of what you have written as I know lots of people who have been, to put it bluntly, bamboozled into thinking that what BB has to offer is legitimate and above board. I respectfully suggest, as you seem very hot on people being polite, that they simply CANNOT have all the facts/evidence as *most* people will not be interested in going into a scheme that is illegal. I say most, because you will know that there are always those who will take the chance and be willing to be involved in such schemes and also those who will actively promote them.
Your words have “peaked my interest” (sic). I don’t know which side of the fence you are on, indeed you may very well be sat square on it. However, the very way that you speak leads others (without the benefit of body language or tone of voice to guide us) to surmise that you are indeed a “BB Apologist”. You may obviously find that offensive, but what you think you said when you wrote your comments and how they are perceived by readers are simply poles apart.
I wouldn’t wish anyone to lose any money, never mind life savings, ever. I also would not wish anyone who connives to take money from people who can’t afford to lose the money to have the benefit of any doubt. Respectfully, I would also suggest that I would not be a friend to anyone by not saying anything if I knew or suspected that the “business” they had invested in the slightest way dodgy. I would expect my real friends to do the same for me.
It is interesting that very few people have commented on Finch’s update with the questions and answers from Terry Stern. Respectfully, I suggest you re-read those, especially the ones where he did not answer, and then come back and we will discuss this further.
DD
So is this supposed to be a poised discussion, or an objective one where you’re open to new logic and explanations that clarify an errors you may have made?
If it’s a poised discussion aimed solely at causing disruption to a progam clearly no-one here understands, then your comments are purely malicious in nature. If it’s a objective one, then you’re looking for explanations towards altering your misconceptions and discovering the error in your interpretations.
I’m curious which it actually is, because thus far, it’s a poised discussion. Terry Stern’s denial to answer questions simply doesn’t demonstrate his unwillingness to devulge information as evidence, it shows as Frank has stated, that he’s unwilling to provide you with more information for you to exploit and abuse in your attempts to further damage the company he works for. In simpler terms, you don’t arm an enemy hell-bent on killing you off with anything they can twist into an instrument for said damage.
A toothbrushs is meant to brush teeth with, not be worn down and sharpened into a ‘shank’, but people do it to harm others frequently. Currently, you’re the ones shanking Banners Broker because you feel it’s your right to.
I’ve read both sides, it’s my opinion, but you aren’t interested in hearing facts or explanations, you’re more interested in continuing this witch hunt until you burn them at the stake. Whether they’re legit or not isn’t even considered here…you’ve already decided they aren’t and now you want your blood. Anyone who contradicts you is also considered a witch and burned.
So you’re the ‘saviours of the internet’ when it comes to BB huh? Who here would lose sleep if the company was closed down, and it was discovered they were in fact a legit company? Who would be concerned for everyone that lost their jobs, and those that couldn’t get paid because of your actions? I dare say not a single one of you would care the least. It’s a double-edged sword accusing someone of something without proof, if you aren’t sure, careful with your swing or you may just harm someone you didn’t intend to.
Oh, and before you say “why would they close down if they were legit?”, think it through. There have been hundreds of people calling and emailing their suppliers, their payment processors, the press, etc; harassing these companies with claims BB is a scam. After a while, it just becomes a hassle to address it and easier to drop the company to remove the hassle and take yourself out of the spotlight.
It’s just another case of internet bullying. No proof needed, just an assumption.
Hey DD
I guess it’s all about risk perception at the end of the day. Doing what I do, I accept more risk than the average bear and that probably comes across in the things I say or the way I put them. I am not adverse to high risk, probably through boredom, stupidity or fear – I don’t know, it’s one of the many things that make everyone different.
Maybe my tone does indicate as you say, that I am a BB apologist, but it still doesn’t change the fact that many have assumed what my position is. It doesn’t mean that I am actually a BB apologist.
I’m not offended, you have pretty much proved my point that people assume, and make their own conclusions on limited information and I know that’s not up for debate, it’s just a natural part of human behaviour. I would like to acknowledge you have been very polite in your wordings, it’s refreshing and very much appreciated.
I’ll have a look through the Q&A at some point.
Finch, thanks for the apology 😉
Frank, are you in BB?
Phil Hendy says:
February 5, 2013 at 4:40 pm
I tried a while ago to find David Hookers TV show without much success. There was a show but I couldn’t tell if it was a proper Tv one or just one of the low ranked cable station offering. If someone oiks provide a clip that would be good (for a laugh, I am sure).
It’s on a local cable tv station in Ontario, I’ll post the clip I found over on RS if I can find it again.
@ C. Grant
“Who here would lose sleep if the company was closed down, and it was discovered they were in fact a legit company?”
If it was discovered that BB were a legitimate company they wouldn’t close down. Why would they when they have a business model where they earn over $40 mil a month. If they were legitimate and were concerned by all the negative publicity they would take legal action against all those “slandering” their company. It seems they want to stay as far away from the courts as possible.
If it walks like a duck, sounds like a duck, in all probability it is a duck!
@Ken
Problem is, none of you have actually proven anything, let alone that BB is in fact a ‘duck’. It also doesn’t look like any of you really care either way, as I’ve said, you’re more concerned with burning your witch, even though none of you are actually sure it’s a witch you’re after.
The words, “probably”, “assume”, “opinion” etc aren’t examples of proof, merely supposition based on incomplete information. If the information you had was complete, it would be no issue for you to provide proof to substantiate your claims.
I may be looking at both sides of the fence, but until your side sheds more light on what you claim to be facts or proof, I’m afraid I’m nowhere near close to jumping over to support you. Your arguments simply have too many holes in them to stand up as convincing.
C.Grant: are you a member of BB?
No.
Can I ask why you are so interested in BB?
C.Grant – Why should I care that you don’t believe my arguments, or the analysis already put forward?
That’s your choice.
You can call this a witch burning all you want. Your comments are going to look just as deluded as the witch burners of the 16th century when time reveals BannersBroker for what it actually is.
Come back in six months and tell me if you still don’t have enough proof.
News from BannersBroker…
“READ CAREFULLY IF YOUR HAVE STP WITHDRAWAL BEING PROCESSED FROM BANNERS BROKER!
STP Payouts are being processed. All affiliates who have pending STP withdrawals, please check your withdrawal logs for PAID STP, and be sure it was paid to the correct STP username.. then check your STP account to see if you received the money or not!!! ASAP!
There are some issues members are finding where the payout is going into the wrong STP account.. if you find this is the case.. please do the following…
* Contact BB Support either by phone or a support ticket. They have been ALERTED about this issue…. Give them the following:
Your BB username,
the Withdrawal ID
STP username/account that the payout was erroneously paid to!!!
* Also, call STP and notify them immediately so they can LOCK that person’s account so they cannot access your money.
DO NOT panic, as this is being taken care of as we speak. In some cases the Withdrawal Log is showing the money was paid to the wrong STP username, but the money is showing up in the correct account at STP… so check carefully!”
—
So some BannersBroker affiliates are about to get their accounts suspended because… BannersBroker sent somebody else’s money to their accounts by mistake.
Never heard of that happening at Google.
For once I feel lucky I didn’t get paid!
Finch, first I respect what you’ve attempted to do here, although I admit that it looks a little like you’re just trying to benefit from the traffic for your own purposes.
What analysis are you referring to exactly?
First, regarding your argument that BB is a cycler, if I were a betting man, I’d bet they chose to approach people in the MLM industry and used the term to attract their initial batch of affiliates…people with a history of building a sales organization. Terry Stern already admitted that the company made some mistakes in how it worded itself in the beginning and is actively working to correct those mistakes. Seems people here don’t want to let them.
Second, you’ve attempted to debunk Terry’s statement about how the company works, even though he’s repeatedly stated the company isn’t an advertising company, nor is it involved in actual advertising. I’ve seen the arguments ignore that statement however, and keep applying the thinking they are an advertising company when creating arguments against them.
Third, if any of you had actually done your research on what blind networks are, then you’d realize they’re everywhere in the advertising industry. If you want to place an ad in the sports section of your local newspaper but don’t specify where precisely you want the ad placed (page, section, area) you’re essentially using that paper’s blind network. With the internet being 500 Million pages, that’s a big paper to try and search for ads people claim they can’t find. My comment to that is, ya think?
Fourth, how far fetched is it really to see BB as a reseller for the ad networks they deal with, that use “panels” (as they’re called) to represent the ad spaces they rent/lease/purchase as part of their reseller packge? Let me paint the picture I see from what I’ve read….
Chris Smith goes to Ad Network A and says, I want to be a reseller, but let me offer you an alternative…to which they say, ok.
The way the system works is they’re assigned ad space based on the successful bidding on that space.(researched through one of the networks) They do this for multiple contracts available from ad network. They then take that space, and split it up into their panels as part of various packges. Since they know the traffic requirements for the panels, they know how much traffic they’ll need to purchase from the network in order to fulfil their obligation to the network for the ads appearing in the spaces. The network never actually releases control over the ads appearing in the spaces, only offering a percentage of the revenue generated from the spaces to BB for providing traffic to them. Since the panels BB uses all have different fulfillment speeds, they can spread the traffic demands for those panels over a longer period of time, generating revenue from the sale of the traffic to affiliates to be applied to the panels.
Now as I understand it, the reseller can charge whatever they want as part of their ‘affiliate’ or reseller packages, and can do the same for the traffic they sell to their affiliates. I’d imagine that BB has tacked on a reasonable profit margin to the cost of buying additional ad space and traffic in order to generate a profit, but I’d hardly say it’s enough to keep the company running. Now from what I’ve been told by a network representative, the profits a reseller can earn can be substantial if they’re dealing in enough ad space and traffic, especially over a prolonged period of time. So, combine the profits from selling traffic and ad space to affiliates with the revenues generated from fulfilling their bids, subtract the commissions they owe their affiliates, it makes sense to me how they’re able to do everything.
Lastly, I can’t comment on why they’re having payment issues with their affiliates, because I don’t honestly know. I used to be in the banking industry, and I do know the ID requirements we have for offshore companies doing business in my country are specific, and I know that anti-money laundering regulations can keep some companies jumping through hoops keeping things in order because the rules change frequently. I’ve personally never worked with a 3rd party payment processor, but some use banking practices that aren’t compliant with many country’s banking policies, so there may be issues there.
Simply stating that it looks like a scam because you can’t make sense of how they operate, or because they’ve made a few administrative errors in how they spoke about themselves is pretty minor. Take a look at what most major companies said about themselves when they started, and look how they’ve changed their tunes as they’ve grown. McDonalds is in the real estate business now, not the restaurant business…they own the best real estate in every city they do business in, the stores are secondary.
Things change, and mistakes are made. Like I said, unless someone can show me that the system doesn’t work as I’ve described it, as I’ve been told by the actual companies providing the reseller services, I’m inclined to believe BB is who they say they are. They need some serious re-working of their marketing practices and language, and some urgency when it comes to fixing and standardizing their payment process, but otherwise they APPEAR to be legit.
I’m not here to offend anyone or call people names, and I apologize if I’ve come across that way. I’ve seen my share of people pissing in other people’s business over the years, and after hearing about BB, I was curious as to what others thought about it. I’m more interested now in finding out what the real issue against the company is than joining them. What I’ve read from people here so far doesn’t match the research I’ve done. So I’m curious as to where you’ve gotten your information from and why it differs from what I’ve found.
As for the BRAZIL MAFIA,…suck my dick.
Bannersbrokers is for loosers brazil, brazil niggardas, loosets.
MAFIAS BRAZIL ? suck my dick please
C.Grant: Why are you so interested in BB?
C.Grant –
“First, regarding your argument that BB is a cycler, if I were a betting man, I’d bet they chose to approach people in the MLM industry and used the term to attract their initial batch of affiliates…people with a history of building a sales organization. Terry Stern already admitted that the company made some mistakes in how it worded itself in the beginning and is actively working to correct those mistakes. Seems people here don’t want to let them.”
—
Do you not see the problem in promising that your company will double the user’s money, and then withdrawing the claim 24 months later when 300,000 members have already joined the program under false pretences?
It is ILLEGAL. False advertising. Every last one of those affiliates should be entitled to a full refund on the basis that BannersBroker has been promoting itself with Message X, when the truth is Message Y. Terry openly admits to this, while flagrantly disregarding any notion that the company has a responsibility to the affiliates it (and its affiliates) has misled.
—
“Second, you’ve attempted to debunk Terry’s statement about how the company works, even though he’s repeatedly stated the company isn’t an advertising company, nor is it involved in actual advertising. I’ve seen the arguments ignore that statement however, and keep applying the thinking they are an advertising company when creating arguments against them.”
—
The company isn’t an advertising company, and it isn’t involved in advertising?
You’ve got to be kidding me.
Go to this page:
http://bannersbroker.com/main/faq
You will find a few gazillion references to the advertising that Terry Stern denies BannersBroker has anything to do with.
I don’t want to call you an idiot, but the clue is in the name: Banners Broker.
Banners, as in forms of advertising.
Brokers, as in brokering ad deals.
How much more involved can you get with advertising while still denying to be an advertising company?
—
“Third, if any of you had actually done your research on what blind networks are, then you’d realize they’re everywhere in the advertising industry. If you want to place an ad in the sports section of your local newspaper but don’t specify where precisely you want the ad placed (page, section, area) you’re essentially using that paper’s blind network. With the internet being 500 Million pages, that’s a big paper to try and search for ads people claim they can’t find. My comment to that is, ya think?”
—
What are you even talking about? Everybody who works in the advertising business knows about blind networks, including myself.
It is the concept of a singular Blind Network that I have a problem with. BannersBroker pawns off the concept of blind networks as if they combine together to form a secret industry that only BannersBroker has the magic key to.
It’s bullshit.
Here’s a task for you.
– Go to Google.
– Search for “The Blind Network”
– Note the results.
The only company talking about a singular Blind Network is BannersBroker. What does that tell you?
—
“The way the system works is they’re assigned ad space based on the successful bidding on that space.(researched through one of the networks) They do this for multiple contracts available from ad network. They then take that space, and split it up into their panels as part of various packges. Since they know the traffic requirements for the panels, they know how much traffic they’ll need to purchase from the network in order to fulfil their obligation to the network for the ads appearing in the spaces. The network never actually releases control over the ads appearing in the spaces, only offering a percentage of the revenue generated from the spaces to BB for providing traffic to them. Since the panels BB uses all have different fulfillment speeds, they can spread the traffic demands for those panels over a longer period of time, generating revenue from the sale of the traffic to affiliates to be applied to the panels.”
—
Simple answer to this is that you are not making any sense. This type of relationship does not exist.
—
“”Now as I understand it, the reseller can charge whatever they want as part of their ‘affiliate’ or reseller packages, and can do the same for the traffic they sell to their affiliates. I’d imagine that BB has tacked on a reasonable profit margin to the cost of buying additional ad space and traffic in order to generate a profit, but I’d hardly say it’s enough to keep the company running. Now from what I’ve been told by a network representative, the profits a reseller can earn can be substantial if they’re dealing in enough ad space and traffic, especially over a prolonged period of time. So, combine the profits from selling traffic and ad space to affiliates with the revenues generated from fulfilling their bids, subtract the commissions they owe their affiliates, it makes sense to me how they’re able to do everything.”
—
You are forgetting the most important piece of the jigsaw. BannersBroker denies that it works with advertisers.
Do you understand the concept of reselling? Somebody has to buy what you’re selling.
This model does not work without advertisers.
—
“Simply stating that it looks like a scam because you can’t make sense of how they operate, or because they’ve made a few administrative errors in how they spoke about themselves is pretty minor. Take a look at what most major companies said about themselves when they started, and look how they’ve changed their tunes as they’ve grown. McDonalds is in the real estate business now, not the restaurant business…they own the best real estate in every city they do business in, the stores are secondary.”
—
No, I can make perfect sense of how they are operating. And it is not how they claim to be operating. It is impossible. Find me one advertising professional who agrees that the BB model is sustainable.
You won’t find one who doesn’t have a vested interest in BannersBroker.
—
“Like I said, unless someone can show me that the system doesn’t work as I’ve described it, as I’ve been told by the actual companies providing the reseller services, I’m inclined to believe BB is who they say they are.”
—
One of the companies that BannersBroker claims to have a private relationship with (OpenX) has already denied that any such relationship exists. Which resellers were you talking to? Provide sources or your opinions remain just that.
—
“I’m not here to offend anyone or call people names, and I apologize if I’ve come across that way. I’ve seen my share of people pissing in other people’s business over the years, and after hearing about BB, I was curious as to what others thought about it. I’m more interested now in finding out what the real issue against the company is than joining them. What I’ve read from people here so far doesn’t match the research I’ve done. So I’m curious as to where you’ve gotten your information from and why it differs from what I’ve found.”
—
I’m not here to offend anybody either.
As for where I got my information? The advertising industry.
I work in it.
I’m not sure where you’ve been getting your information, but it sounds like it came from a David Hooker presentation. And those, I can assure you, are bullshit through and through.
C.Grant –
Go here: http://bannersbroker.com/main/advertiser
Listen to the voiceover.
Once again, tell me how this company is not involved with advertising.
And once again, you might want to refer to the URL. There’s a hidden clue in it.
Is ANYONE ready to take this circular discussion offline and turn it into a straighforward upline uppercut to the Hooker’s chin?
Martin ‘I’m not here to offend anybody either’Finch doesn’t talk to me except when he chooses to be personally abusive. The same goes for Nick. The two resident industry ‘experts’ are therefore no use to me.
Therefore, can someone please tell me how I can find out about meetings such as the one in West Bromwich, BEFORE they occur!?
Della Cate? BB Insider?, Ditto Ditto?, Phil Hendy?…anyone?…anyone apart from Adreasheinz that is! :/
This is actually exactly the issue Finch, you’re still thinking it’s BB that’s buying and selling the advertising, or reselling it to their affiliates.
Ad space isn’t advertising in itself, it’s the space the advertising goes in, which as has already been stated, the ad network fills, not BB. BB is reselling the space to the affiliate, not the advertising, they don’t touch that part. They bid on the spaces that have advertising already in them, and once their bids have successfully secured those spaces, they partition them, sell them to the affiliates and pay the affiliate a portion of the revenue generated by the spaces (or more aptly, state the space is worth $.15/1000 impressions but agree to pay the affiliate $.30/1000 impressions when BB earns an additional $.35/1000 impressions). In order for the ad spaces to generate revenue, traffic has to be applied. Since BB knows how many spaces are there (through the number of panels) they also know the amount of traffic needed, so they charge the affiliate for the traffic at a rate of $1/1000 impressions, pay the network $.35/1000 impressions and profit the difference. Any money collected from affiliates for packages goes towards purchasing additional ad space for the affiliates to use and traffic so they can generate revenue for 2 complimentary cycles. At the end, the affiliate has their initial purchase back and an equivilent amount in panels to earn from. BB makes a small profit I’m sure from this part, but would never be nearly enough to pay their affiliates with.
This is basically how it works directly from the ad network I spoke to as a potential reseller.
The question is do you understand how reselling works in this case?
Ad network sells space to BB upon a successful bid.
BB resells space to affiliates through packages.
Affiliates buy traffic to generate revenue from the panels in packages.
BB applies traffic purchased to the ad spaces it has bid on to generate revenue.
Ad network pays BB their commission based on the bid rate and applied traffic.
Seriously, have any of you even bothered to contact one of these companies as a potential reseller to find out how their system works? Took me about 15 minutes and compared my findings to Terry Stern’s statement to see if he was telling the truth. Turns out he was. That doesn’t say that BB’s marketing doesn’t need a lot of work, or that it needs to police what its affiliates are saying better, but what BB is saying matches what the white label network I spoke with described. Who did I talk to? Do your own research, not one of you have stated any verifiable resources where you found your anti-BB information (probably because most of you are guessing), why should I? Once again, because now I won’t share my sources you’re going to accuse me now of being a bad man in an attempt to discredit what I’ve said? Do your own homework, show your sources.
To the ad network, BB holds the spaces its bid on, and that’s where the relationship ends. The ad networks don’t deal with affiliates, and affiliates don’t deal with advertisers. The option for BB to attract both advertisers and publishers is actually part of the reseller program, and doesn’t involve BB directly in the sale of either service to customers. BB only earns a commission for attracting new business to the ad network, as the software BB uses integrates into the network’s own software system. BB had the option of using their software, or integrating the network’s API into custom software.
Remnant inventory doesn’t mean junk ads, it means ad inventory that hasn’t fulfilled it’s contractual obligation.
As to why BB uses affiliates, I think that’s clear. The amount of traffic they can leverage against the ad space they’ve successfully bid on, and the sales revenue they collect gives them the ability to grow far quicker than any other business model.
There are tons of flaws in your assumptions about BB, starting with your assumption that it’s BB that’s involved in the actual advertising end of things, when BB only deals with spaces that already have advertising in them. And no offence, but a 25 year old claiming to be in the advertising industry and saying it’s impossible that BB can’t possibly be doing what it claims, when a simple google search on white label ad networks says otherwise; calls into question how much ad industry knowledge you really have.
Oh, I don’t see how those affiliates were signed up under false pretenses. The program said initially that it would double their money, and now states that the program provides a return equal to twice the initial inventory purchase price. It’s been reworded and cleaned up, but still says the same thing.
With regards to finding you an advertising professional that would agree it’s sustainable…apparently the nice lady I spoke with agrees with how BB says the model works…and since there’s no way of validating who you are or why you want it, I wouldn’t release my client list to you either.
“Della Cate? BB Insider?, Ditto Ditto?, Phil Hendy?…anyone?…anyone apart from Adreasheinz that is! :/”
ASAP, thats Manchester. Sorry to say. Swiss RE, Washington Post, etcetc are in.
@ my dear friend d.pressed:
Finch “nuzked” the “choice network”
Nick “nuked” the “blind network”
Dont know if i like the Finchman or the Nickman, but fantastic job!
C.Grant – You are clearly a troll, sent here by BB, with those famously convoluted paragraphs that say a lot about nothing. Let me address just a couple of glaring problems with your description of the business model. If it can even be called a description.
—
“BB is reselling the space to the affiliate, not the advertising,”
—
Do you know what actually goes in to that ‘space’?
Answer: Banner ads.
Do you know what goes in to a banner ad?
Answer: Advertising.
Do you know who has to buy that ‘space’ for it to be filled with banner ads?
Answer: An advertiser, with a tangible product/service to promote.
—
“They bid on the spaces that have advertising already in them, and once their bids have successfully secured those spaces, they partition them, sell them to the affiliates and pay the affiliate a portion of the revenue generated by the spaces (or more aptly, state the space is worth $.15/1000 impressions but agree to pay the affiliate $.30/1000 impressions when BB earns an additional $.35/1000 impressions).”
—
Tell me Mr. Oracle of Ontario, how do you think revenue is generated by the ad space?
Answer: By advertisers.
The ad network already has both advertisers and publishers.
What makes you stupid enough to think Ad Network X is going to pay Publisher Y $0.15/1000 impressions for their inventory, but Broker Z (who merely rents the same inventory) receives $0.35/1000 impressions?
In this fantasy scenario, not only does the Ad Network lose margin (paying 0.35 instead of 0.15), but the publisher loses revenue (receiving 0.15 instead of 0.35). All to satisfy a third party who brings no advertisers and no publishers to the table.
There’s a very simple analogy for this bullshit you’re spouting.
Instead of a publisher, imagine I am renting out a room in my house. An estate agent is in charge of delivering the tenants. The tenants are the ‘advertisers’, those who seek the product.
Landlord – Publisher (owns the property)
Tenant – Advertiser (rents the property)
Estate agency – Network (connects landlords to tenants)
BannersBroker – RoomsBroker (…??? ….profits)
I ‘own’ the physical room, and I might pay the estate agency £50/month for as long as I have one of their tenants. Let’s say the tenant is paying me £500/month. Minus the service fee, I’m making £450/month.
Now suppose that a company called RoomsBroker comes along and says, “We want to rent the ownership your room, but we also have our investors to pay, therefore our service charge is going to be £160/month.”
That might break up like this:
– £50/month to the estate agent (their usual fee to ‘find the tenant’)
– £100/month to the affiliate (doubling their money)
– £10/month for RoomsBroker
Let’s assume the affiliate initially pays £50/month. To cover the only tangible expense, and to be ‘doubled’ with the proposed agreement)
Now there are two problems:
1. Tenants do not like to be charged £160/month when they can get the same service elsewhere for £50/month by working directly with the estate agent.
£450 rental income beats £340 rental income
2. Estate agents do not like to surrender £110/month to a third party who brings ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to the table. No tenants, no landlords. If the tenant is willing to be charged $160/month for their service, they will charge it themselves.
Where you believe this model can be saved is when, and I quote:
“In order for the ad spaces to generate revenue, traffic has to be applied. Since BB knows how many spaces are there (through the number of panels) they also know the amount of traffic needed, so they charge the affiliate for the traffic at a rate of $1/1000 impressions, pay the network $.35/1000 impressions and profit the difference.”
This is the crux.
In our analogy, it is like saying:
“In order for the rooms to generate revenue, tenants have to be found. Since RoomsBroker knows how many empty rooms there are, they also know the amount of tenants needed. So they charge their affiliates £500/month to rent each room:”
£340 goes to the landlord (who might be wondering why the room remains empty)
£50 goes to the estate agency (for connecting them to the landlord)
£110 goes to RoomsBroker
The affiliate ‘fills’ the tenancy. That is your description of the business model, not mine.
The problem is that:
– Room X is physically owned by a landlord, who receives less for working with RoomsBroker.
– Room X is leased to an affiliate, who doubles £50 in to £100. Sounds good, right? But wait…
– Room X is then rented by the affiliate, who doesn’t even live there, and pays £500/month for the privilege
After the maths, the only party left in profit is RoomsBroker.
If this model seems a little illogical to you (people renting rooms without living in them and somehow doubling their money), then BINGO!
We’re finally seeing some sense.
Welcome to the wonderful world of BannersBroker. Where products don’t actually exist.
—
“Who did I talk to? Do your own research, not one of you have stated any verifiable resources where you found your anti-BB information (probably because most of you are guessing), why should I?”
—
Without a source, I’m not taking you seriously.
Those long, shambolic paragraphs sure do remind me of an old friend, one who’s also based in Ontario.
Happy trolling.
Same location…
Same browser/OS preferences…
Same aimless explanations…
Same grammar patterns…
Same choice of phrasing…
Same rhetoric…
Same lies?
C.Grant/Terry, I know you are reading.
Can you please give me an explanation as to why I, or my downline(all 2 of them) can’t get paid. It over two months for me now, just under for the others.
Also, don’t you think in the interest of the affiliates such as us, that your legal team should go after the negative posters? You say they are damaging the company. This in turn damages the ability of the affiliates to earn. Should you not defend your affiliates???
Dear D Pressed
There is a meeting in Romford on 19th Feb (I think it is) – I have posted details on Real Scam. It may be a couple of pages back now, but I posted it yesterday.
I find information from various affiliate’s sites and Facebook pages. Cannot remember them all off hand (I am not at home right now) – but am happy to provide some details of what I look at later on.
They don’t tend to give too much notice of these events, and I suspect that they are aimed at existing members so they can bring along possible new members. Certainly the one in Bristol last week attracted 100 people, of whom around a third were apparently “guests”.
The world tour in manchester is going to be very interesting
“Thanks to your posting my home address, my picture and a picture of my home, I find out that there have been 3 people already that have come by and harassed my neighbours looking for information about me and spreading rumors about the company I work for. My girlfriend having learned this is so worried for her and her daughte that she will not stay in the house until such time as this has been resolved, in fact I just had to drive her to her parents house because some asshole woke us up to verify that I am “That” Terry Stern working for Stellar Point. This is what your objective is?”
Terry Stern at http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index326.html
This is not my objective! Really, really sorry. This is the second offense of the “anti-BBers”. Hope the Finchman-site can make a corrective. Gimme a third and I’m off.
As for the: “BannersBrojer started that kind of shit etcetc”. No. Nope. Nyet – RED FLAG – NOT. NEVER.
I do love this kind of blog-war? I do NOT acccept any kindf of collateral damage.
The daughter of a girlfrind? ARE YOU CRAZY!
I’m not sure why I need to give an opinion on it. But for what it’s worth, I don’t agree with those posting Terry’s personal details in public.
The man deserves to be ruined professionally, and he will be, but his personal life is a different matter altogether. Throwing around the home address is only likely to cause distress for his family, who may be (and probably are) completely innocent.
We can all find this information if we want to.
I have the current addresses (and many past addresses) of Terry Stern, David Hooker, Raj Dixit and so on. But their families are not responsible for the lies and deceit. Nothing is to be gained by exposing that information in public.
That’s just my opinion. I’m not responsible for what goes on over at RealScam.
Finch,
You’ve got muddled in your analogy and used the word tenant in a place you should have used landlord, I’m not going to copy and paste what you put, it should be easy for all to see if you read it properly. I know you won’t delete or change it as you do seem to fair in that sense and trust you will admit to the error.
It’s interesting that you use the analogy you did. Firstly, believe it or not, you have actually accidentally stumbled across a process that does actually exist, not the exact way you describe it, but allow me to elaborate…
There are plenty of landlords out there with empty or partially let properties, despite being with an estate agent. There is a process where, if you are in that position and have an empty room or property, you can contact your local council, and depending on their policies etc, can offer a guaranteed council tenant, that is in need of housing. Now this is usually done through a property management company, which is not necessarily an estate agent.
So the analogy you use does exist and they do enable something ‘to be brought to the table’. This is guaranteed occupancy, for a lower rate. If you had a property to rent out and struggled to fill it through an estate agent, would you not rather take a smaller cut and ensure the property was at least occupied? Or would you just settle for what the estate agent is doing or not doing?
I’m sure however you will find fault in what I have put above. You have also yet again proved that you are very good indeed at making vast assumptions, by insinuating that C.Grant and T.Stern are the same person. Whether they are or not is irrelevant, there is absolutely no way you can prove it either way – yet one of your followers at least seems to believe you. It just smacks to me that you are grasping at straws and smells a bit desperate to me. I also feel that we both have a different understanding of what ‘evidence’ actually is.
On a final note, I find it an absolute disgrace with regards to recent posts mentioned above and the involvement of personal stuff. I agree Finch, personal life is a different matter and it’s a disgrace this has gone this far, people involved in those posts should be ashamed of themselves.
One thing I love in this C. Grant (Cary Grant, nice one) bullshit explanation is how he is now using more realistic pricing for the remnant inventory that they would have to be buying if they had a chance to put a markup on it and then double it.
Now we are talking about $0.15 and $0.35 CPM, whereas BB are selling inventory at $8 CPM to their affiliates. Sorry did I say affiliates, I meant marks.
Way to deflect and not have to show people how unrealistic the numbers really are.
Terry/Cary, every attempt that you make to do something “clever” is backfiring on you. Keep it up 🙂
Oh and $0.15 CPM isn’t even remnant, its worst of the worst bullshit remnant.
As I said before if the scammers where in any way smart this is exactly what they would be doing, buying the bottom of the barrel remnant inventory for $0.15 CPM and selling it to their affiliates for $8 CPM and thus it cannot be claimed that the affiliates are not getting nothing for their money so no fraud would be being committed.
The problem with that though is that no one in their right mind would buy this garbage traffic for even $1 on the open market let alone $8 or $16+ which is what BB are claiming. So the scheme falls down on the fact that there would be no buyer at the other end as it would be like selling a hamburger for the price of a Ferrari.
@ C. Grant
“The words, “probably”, “assume”, “opinion” etc aren’t examples of proof, merely supposition based on incomplete information. If the information you had was complete, it would be no issue for you to provide proof to substantiate your claims.
I may be looking at both sides of the fence, but until your side sheds more light on what you claim to be facts or proof, I’m afraid I’m nowhere near close to jumping over to support you. Your arguments simply have too many holes in them to stand up as convincing.”
Simple math, based on BB’s figures, will show you that the majority of their revenue is not from advertising but from the members themselves. And that, at least in Canada, is illegal and descibes “Ponzi” to a tee.
Monthly revenue (according to BB claims): $40 mil
Source: 300,000 members at $15/m admin fees: $4.5 mil
Traffic Packs (average 1.75 per member): $50×300,000=$15 mil
New Sign ups (averaging 10,000 @average $1,000, probably low); $10 mil
5% processing fee for members: let’s say if 300,000 are withdrawing an average of $500/m (probably extremely low as everyone claims they are withdrawing thousands)=300,000x500x5%=$7.5 mil
Total revenue from members only: $37 mil
Now, you can dispute this by showing me how much of the $40 mil is coming from advertisements/renting ad space or whatever. Also, prove me wrong on the numbers above.
Great site.
To be fair, Martin, the address published on realscam is the one that Stern himself lists as his trading address on his commercial website, or rather it was until earlier today, all contact information having now been removed.
It would be a different matter entirely if someone has gone and lifted it from the electoral roll or another source that wasn’t readily available online, however it was Stern placed it in the public domain and invited prospective customers to contact him there.
I don’t agree with people turning up at his door though, and to be honest I can’t see what purpose doing so would serve, as I doubt he really knows what is going on within BB, given that, at the end of the day, he’s just a hired mouthpiece for the crooks behind the scam.
Did all your above figures come from official BB channels Ken? Or are the figures, under where you said ‘from BB sources’ (next to monthly revenue), an estimate by yourself?
You say ‘prove me wrong on the numbers above’ – surely people have as much chance as proving you wrong as you have in proving them right, resulting in stalemate and as many have said a circular argument?
I recommend people watch the ‘Chef Aid’ episode of South Park and listen to the Chewbacca defense, truly an absolute work of complete genius!!
Stern has shown himself to be a liar and I wouldn’t believe for one second that someone came to his house or talked to his neighbors, it’s just another one of his tall tales.
If any of what he says is true he and BB would have filed a lawsuit long ago and taken posters from Realscam and Finch to court. In fact most of the posters are more than happy to go to court as BB would then HAVE to prove that they are not a scam (during the discovery phase). This is why BB will not and have not sued anyone. This would NEVER happen with a real company as their reputation and brand would be worth a hell of a lot more than the cost of a suit (especially if they had in house lawyers).
One thing is having a piddly blog defaming your company, another is having a site that is at the top of the search engines and is attracting newspaper interest.
Terry was right, you aren’t listening…or reading for that matter.
There is no sale of the advertising to BB or their affiliates, only the rights to generate income from the space the ad network provides as per the terms of their reseller agreement.
The Ad Network or “Landlord” in your example, uses BB “Management Company” to look after the space that they, the Landlord, have already filled, and pay them a dividend from the revenue generated by the Advertiser “Tennant”. BB then attracts Affiliates or “Property Managers” to monitor and manage the individual spaces, and pays them a fee for doing so. If the Landlord rents a space for $500, and contracts a Management Company to manage the space for $350, and the Management Company pays the Property Manager $150 for their efforts, everyone has made money, no-one has been cheated.
Yes there’s advertising in the spaces, but BB isn’t responsible for it, in fact, they aren’t allowed to put advertising in the spaces as per the terms of their contract with the ad network. All advertising goes to the ad network directly.
You and others keep saying that they’re reselling the space at a profit, well that’s partially true, except that the profit comes from discounting the value of the ad space being sold to the affiliates, not marking it up. In other words, BB bids on the space saying they’ll fulfill the demands for $.70/1000 impressions. They turn around and say to their affiliates that the space’s purchase price is based on a value of $.15/1000 impressions, but will pay them $.30/1000 impressions to drive traffic to it. The Affiliate makes $.30/1000 and BB makes $.40/1000. Based on this analogy, BB pays its affiliates from the revenue generated from the spaces, not their package purchases. The cost to the affiliate is built into the bid they make. From what I can see, where BB makes the majority of its money is through the ad spaces and from selling bulk traffic to the affiliates at a marked-up price, but there’s nothing illegal about that.
I don’t know where the figure of $40 Million came from, I’ve never read that anywhere from a BB source, however, if BB has 300,000 affilites, and each affiliate only has 4 panels each, then that’s 1.2 Million ad spaces generating $.70/1000 impressions revenue. If we look at traffic, and say that each space requires 15,000 impressions (costing $15) and one month in order to run its course, then that works out to $12.6 Million/month. What we didn’t factor in, is that BB offers 7 different panels with different traffic requirements and 7 different maturity periods. (300,000x4x15)x$.70 = $12,600,000/month
Subtract the $5.4 Million due to pay the affiliates, and the company still generates $7.2 Million a month by the above example, or $86.4 Million a year.
Some require more traffic than others, so it’s realistic for them to generate the kind of numbers they claim, and pay their affiliates. I imagine some people have hundreds of panels, and with the smallest panel only requiring $5 worth of traffic and a return of $20, it’s safe to say the most popular panel out there is the $20 panel. So some panels mature quicker than others generating a little bit of revenue for the company, while others mature over a prolonged period generating sustained revenue for the company. The amount of traffic they pay for depends on the amount of active panels running since the ad networks say they charge for traffic based on the amount actually used. So BB makes a lot from the sale of traffic, makes a little less from the ad revenue, and the affiliate’s revenue is factored into the ad space bid. Seems to me that the smaller panels pay the quickest generating some revenue for the affiliate to demonstrate earnings, but the real money takes time as it comes from the longer running panels.
How exactly is this a scam? It’s complicated, but it all adds up.
now it’s $0.70 CPM haha. How long until it gets up to the $8 level?
You seem to have an outstanding amount of knowlege for someone who is neither part of BB management or an affiliate *wink wink
One definition of a ponzi is “an organisation with affiliates who bring nothing to the table”. In the case of BB, their affiliates do no “work” except perform a few mouse-clicks. They simply give BB money and (according to BB) get much more back in return. Thus affiliates only cost BB money. The affiliates are commercially useless. Why therefore have them? They are utterly pointless. UNLESS BB is a ponzi.
Nick,
I once thought you were a knowledgable professional, now I know you to be a punk.
I, unlike any here, have actually done my research, called a white label ad network and inquired into how the system operated as a potential reseller. Then I compared what they said with what BB has said, and the answers were basically the same. That’s how I have more knowledge than you on the matter.
I’ve seen your tone change frequently becoming more abusive in your comments. You don’t have the knowledge you claim to, or what’s been stated by Terry Stern would make sense to you. Anyone in the ad industry with knowledge of how ad network reseller programs work, knows what BB is doing is within normal specs. What you can’t accept is that someone with an idea built it into a commercially beneficial solution, and is generating income off of it, while you’re not.
Can’t poke holes in the truth son, that’s why they call it the truth. Your disbelief doesn’t make it all of the sudden false, it just makes you ignorant.
Maynard,
So you’re basing your argument on your opinion that there’s nothing for them to do. Apparently you’re young and have no practical understanding of how leverage works, because if you did, you would be able to see how having an organization of over 300,000 people buying impressions for generating revenue from ad space is commercialy useful. Your failure to understand the business model dosn’t negate it’s validity.
“BB then attracts Affiliates or “Property Managers” to monitor and manage the individual spaces, and pays them a fee for doing so. If the Landlord rents a space for $500, and contracts a Management Company to manage the space for $350, and the Management Company pays the Property Manager $150 <<>> , everyone has made money, no-one has been cheated.” (C.Grant)
Even a bot could manage those spaces without then the “Management Company” having to pay that bot: morever, BB itself has introduced in some countries the “advertising coordinator” that works for us, preventing us from make so much <<>> (sarchasm)
The only thing BB need is our money, not our skills
@ C Grant alias Terry (your writing style is SUCH a giveaway!)
The reality is that affiliates give BB some money. That money (according to Terry) is SUPPOSEDLY used to “purchase traffic which results in ad contracts being fulfilled”. Given that the affiliates get DOUBLE their money back, BB must make MORE THAN DOUBLE on the deal. Sorry, but there’s no way that’s possible.
Banners are a falling market where prices are exceptionally keen. There is simply nowhere in the process that prices can be more than doubled. And even if they could, BB would be using their own money to do the buying and selling, instead of giving massive profits away to affiliates who do nothing.
“efforts” in <>
C GRANT SAYS: “Apparently you’re young and have no practical understanding of how leverage works, because if you did, you would be able to see how having an organization of over 300,000 people buying impressions for generating revenue from ad space is commercialy useful.”
I REPLY: So you’re saying that BB use the pool of affiliate money to buy impressions in massive bulk, thus getting them for less than half the price anyone else could achieve? You do realise that defines BB as a collective investment, don’t you?
Wow, a very good argument Marnard, too bad what you’re implying is actually misleading and inaccurate.
Any company doing business uses a portion of its sales revenue to repurchase inventory and supplies. It’s not illegal, nor is it classified as “collective investment”.
So now I’m Terry am I? I’m not even going to dignify that with a response. Idiot.
fgbhot,
I considered that this may have been an intelligent thought, but realized it’s not. The program belongs to the white label ad networks BBI does busines with, not BBI. So you’re arguing a point that can’t be argued.
In case you weren’t aware, the term “white label” refers to the ability for a company to rebrand another’s product as their own.
I actually think I’m doing a better job at explaining things than Terry did at this point. No offense Terry.
Why are you so interested in BB Grant? Are you an affiliate, employee or both?
I’m none of the above. I’m actually more interested in the points made here and how obvious they are at being inaccurate.
You claim to be here to expose people to what you feel is a scam and learn how the company was able to do what it claims, and I initially came here to read up on it after someone presented me with the opportunity. After reading through all the responses, I found the tone to quickly turn to an agressive one, and everyone openly rejected his explanation stating it wasn’t possible. So I did my own research to see which side was actually correct…which I believe is what people here have claimed people should do. Well, I did, and he wasn’t lieing to you, the company actually operates like he described. I think he could have done a better job than he did explaining, things like showing a better breakdown of how the bidding system works, and how BB takes the profits they get from the ad networks and breaks it down to their affiliates, but in essence he’s been honest.
I can’t speak to payment issues, I know that with what he’s said about International Banking regulations is accurate as it pertains to needing certain forms of ID, and how International Money Laundering laws play a role in how payments work, but I can’t speak to the delays in paying people. I can’t believe however, that the payment issues are as wide-spread as they’ve been accused of.
The bottom line is, although profits come from ad revenue, the sale of traffic and from the affiliates, it takes all 3 forms of revenue to be able to make their machine work. They can’t survive on just one form of it, and the key to making it all work, is staggering the maturity of the panels, so they can spread the traffic demands out over a prolonged period of time, rather than have to address it all at once. It’s a clever system I’ll admit, although semi-complicated for the average person to understand.
I didn’t come here to make enemies, but I’ll also call it like I see it. If you speak like an asshat, I’ll treat you like one.
I think if they got their payment issues straightened out, there would be no issues about whether they’re a scam or not though. That seems to be the basis for many of your arguments.
Are those suppositions you are making about me Grant?
(by the way, there is no way I believe you would spend all this time here if you did not have a connection to BB)
Why the compulsion to be here? It is very strange.
@ C. Grant
“I don’t know where the figure of $40 Million came from, I’ve never read that anywhere from a BB source, however, if BB has 300,000 affilites, and each affiliate only has 4 panels each,…….. maturity periods. (300,000x4x15)x$.70 = $12,600,000/month
Subtract the $5.4 Million due to pay the affiliates, and the company still generates $7.2 Million a month by the above example, or $86.4 Million a year.”
There are no official figures from BB and if you think $40 mil is low then it is even worse. You figure that about $12 mil comes from the sale of “panels”.
How can the company then say that from the over $30 mil it earns every month the majority is from the sales of panels?
And using your numbers of $5.4 mil the company pays back to its affiliates means that the average a member gets back from their investment is a whopping $18.00 every month. ($5.4 mil/300,000). Somehow that figure doesn’t equate to what everybody is stating they are making with BB.
Ken, the BB website clearly states….
” Typical income of a typical Banners Broker member: USD $567.57/year
*All prices shown in USD currency.” or about $47.30/month.
Remember, I said some members have hundreds of panels, some less, and it’s also said it takes time. Sure they double your money, but turning $10 into $20 in a few weeks isn’t what I’d classify as a red flag. I can do that at a poker machine in a few minutes if it’s a good day.
Whatever figures people are bragging about, so what? If they’ve done it, it’s probably taken them a while to do it. I have yet to read anywhere that someone claimed to have made thousands a month after they joined on $20. It’s not possible.
I’ve done the math, it would take a purchase of about $3,000 6+ months to generate anything worth bragging about. If you’re smart and a good neworker, I’ve read about people making $15,000 their first month selling nutritional supplements. Those companies are the ones that raise my eyebrow, not some startup banner brokerage earning people $10/month on a panel.
That’s why I can’t figure out why everyone is so up-in-arms over these guys? You’d make quicker returns putting $3,000 into a GIC for 6 months. There’s just better growth potential the longer you’re in the system with BB from what I see. I’m impatient, I don’t want to wait that long to see that kind of growth.
Still here grant. You must have an incredible amount of time on your hands if you are willing to be here so much…considering you claim to have nothing to do with BB…
1. colored banners (Las Vegas is envious)
2. promo121.com (that was a good one 😉 )
3. choice network (its in beta stage)
(3.5 – blind network, forget that)
4. STELLARPOINT a direct marketing company. Product is customer support. LMAO
BannersBrokerInternational aint a garage no more? Maybe its a SOHO Small Office/ HOME Office. All the stuff is at StellarPoint?
StellarPint dont do banner-ads. They re-sells customer support. E-mail, fon, marheting-seminars. Everything you need to start-up a company. Something like a “ScamBuilder 1.0. Just no ads. http://www.stellarpoint.ca/
@ C. Grant
And I suppose you are going to try and convince us all that a company that is organisationally and administratively so apallingly badly run and with such delinquent and morally bankrupt (non) payment methods is a real and proper business, a business that is run so badly that any real business would fail and go bankrupt using such methods.
Are you also going to support Terry in his attempt to mislead us all as to why BB will not use PayPal when his own online jewellery business uses PayPal exclusively?
AS I stated on RealScam in a longer post, it is almost irrelevant to me whether the business model works or not, it is the (mis) organisation and (mis) administration that should immediately highlight that this cannot be a proper business and must be a scam.
NO GENUINE BUSINESS OPERATES LIKE THIS, WHEREAS ALMOST ALL HYIP AND PONZI SCAMS DO OPERATE LIKE THIS.
For the life of me, I just do not understand that anyone can look at the way schemes like this operate and think they are genuine. The “product” is almost irrelevant, it is the operation that surely any sane person must look at and ask themselves “WHY?”
BannersBrokerInternational offers four ways to speed up the Internet
– Standard traffic booster §8
– Premium traffic booster $5
– Executive traffic booster $4
– Recruting. Recruting boost ALL Panells (yellow, pink… executive. You name it).
Cary/Terry/Asshat you are so transparent. No one writes such verbose and in depth posts on something they have no interest in, why would someone care that much and put themselves through such ridicule for no reason.
Also, how arrogant you must be to think that you could know more about how internet advertising works than people in the industry. Just because it seems to make sense to you doesn’t mean diddly if you don’t know anything about the online advertising industry (which I bet you will now come on and state you have been involved with it for years…..yeah right).
So assuming you know nothing about the industry and are not an insider in the company then what makes you think you could properly debate with people who work in the industry on a daily basis?
As a professional in the industry I am saying that what you and Terry are both trying to tell us about how the program works and makes money for everyone is utter twaddle and anyone who is in our industry would tell you the same.
Go try and find anyone with any standing in the online advertising industry and get them to verify that this program is any more than one big scam. You wont be able to.
Funny how not one member of BB has come forward and said that they are an online advertiser and the program makes absolute sense to them and they have joined. It would be much easier for someone who is actually in the industry to try to fight back rather than crappy shills and pimps like you/Terry/asshat.
D pressed. Can’t remember if you are a member or not but Talking BB has an entry level will show you the meetings in each area. Otherwise have a look on some of the Facebook and LinkedIn groups.
Ooops Mr/Mrs Grant you done goofed!
You have posted over at realscam under the wrong persona.
I quote the message from the user tdstern (Terry Stern):-
“Since BB needs to bid on the spaces it holds, let’s use a rate of $.70/1000 impressions as what the network will pay BBI for fulfilling the traffic requirements.
BB takes that space, and says the space is worth $.15/1000 impressions but will give the affiliate $.30/1000 impressions for driving traffic to that space.”
So Mr Stern is now using YOUR revised (down) example CPM rates to illustrate how the system works. You who is neither in the industry or is a company insider. Coincidence??? hmmmm
Ooops 🙂
I did say I was retired. Retired = Time, and don’t presume you know anything about me.
So Nick, you’re going to try and convince people that you’re in the advertising industry, and an authority to bank on, when you’re still arguing the wrong side of the fence? Did they teach you to read and understand? Is English your first language, or do I need to translate for you?
I don’t need to try and tell you anything if you’re such a professional. Have you ever heard of “White Label Ad Networks”? If not, you really need to Google the term son before you continue, or you’ll look like a fool moreso than you already do.
White label ad networks allow for the rebranding of services, without the hassle of having to deal with advertising contracts. The company handles all of the details in securing the advertising for the ad spaces for you, the reseller is required to handle the traffic side of things through purchasing traffic…or more accurately, having traffic diverted to the ad spaces for a fee to allow them to generate revenue.
Now since you’re incapable of speaking with any sort of respect for those you communicate with, I’ll put it in terms you’ll understand.
Get your head out of your ass and start acting like you belong in the industry you claim to instead of a whiny punk. White label solutions are all over the place in just about every industry, and if you were worth half of what you claim you’d already know that. They give start-ups the ability to instantly have products and/or services without the development costs, and offer software solutions for companies to track and resell their products. Any dipshit that’s been working in the advertising industry knows all about this process, who the companies are, and with very little effort could know all about it. I’ve already stated I was in the banking industry, not the advertising industry, just like BB…not in the advertising industry. A broker who resells oil, isn’t in the oil industry. A broker who resells ad space isn’t in the advertising industry.
Lookie, lookie… http://www.myadmarket.com/ there’s one now. and before you go spouting off that it’s a figment of my imagination, or that they can’t provide BB with anything close to what they’ve stated, have some tea and a shit. This is but one of a few networks I looked into, that provide the services BB would need to do what they say they do…understand? One. There are others, and they offer access to a whole lot of ads and traffic through their combined network, along with software, and support to make a program like BB’s run.
I didn’t say I knew more than you about the advertising industry, but I do know more than you about this son, as I’ve actually picked up the phone and called one of these companies to find out how I could start my own program. They were very helpful in helping me understand how the process works, and how the reseller end of things works. But I didn’t come off like I had a chip on my shoulder either, I actually spoke to them plainly and asked precise questions that directed their answers to my information needs.
I love playing with mental midgets, they always try to reach higher than they should, and fall flat on their face as a result.
At the end of the day, I’ve got the time and I’ve done the research. You have a whole lot of attitude, and are arguing from the wrong side of the fence son. Give your head a shake and try again. The programs already exist, and BB is but one company using them, accept it because it’s an undisputable fact.
Excellent, I’m glad I could help him with my example, probably because it makes sense. If you’d only stop and think things through before typing your finger diarhea you’d realize that he’s been speaking the truth the whole time.
Why is it exactly you’re attacking this company so hard I wonder? You’ve failed to prove anything they’re doing is actually wrong except taking too long to pay their affiliates. You claim they can’t be doing what they are, but the ad networks support them by supplying the system.
Funny how some people need to try and swim upstream before they realize it’s easier if they went with the flow.
Ok, I’m going to put my grandkids to bed. Have fun trying to figure out how to make the truth of things not the truth of things.
Nighty Night.
Busted! Night night Terry *cough* Cary
Just to confirm, C.Grant is Terry Stern.
I’ve cross checked his IP here with the IP of the tstern account on RealScam.
Exact match.
Busted, indeed.
Today’s message directly from BBI includes the sentence “BBI has paid out over $4 million through Solid Trust Pay and over $7 million to the BB Card”
Let’s do some maths… assuming 1/2 or less of the 300,000 affiliates have been with BBI for long enough to build some real cash and are getting paid.
Let’s say 100,000 not 300,000 (as some claim are on their books).
The above $4m + $7m = $11 million.
This is an average of $110 cash paid per affiliate!!! Of only the first 100,000. The other 200,000 affiliates (say) are recently signed up and take nothing out….
Some of the affiliates claim to be making zillions…. and one would guess are taking out some pocket-money ??!!
If some folks are correct and have really taken out $20,000 or $50,000…. this would bring the average down for everyone else… Looks like a pyramid shape to me.
Will anyone get rich taking out a mere $110 cash IN TOTAL ever since they joined BBI????
I rest my case.
So Terry Stern and C. Grant are the same person. Thanks Finch.
Terry/Grant: So you do have a vested interest in BB. You should have just said so. Why did you change your name and tell lies?
You truly have no credibility now. I thought you may be able to help with my case but it seems you are just another liar involved with BB.
(we all new you were heavily involved with BB. noone would spend that amount of time with something they didn’t have a vested interest in. how stupid do you think we are??)
Terry/Grant
at this point you have no longer credibility
It was not a good choise to post as another person
If this is what the PR person does it really is a very bad reflection on BB. I assume with this revelation, BB will move to remove Terry as a rep for the company. As an affiliate I would suggest that this is done immediately.
BB – a bigger joke by the day.
Look guys, grow up. This is not a scam and the only people who seem to beleive so are the half a dozen or so who visit this site and realscum.
Get a life whilst we enjoy the high life.
Nice one Finch!
I take it you are a an affiliate Mark? Are you happy with the way the PR company for BB are conducting themselves?
Just reading back over C.Grant’s comments… what an idiot.
This is the Public Relations Director of an ‘international company’, and he spends his time posting essays under a false identity whilst using it to praise himself.
Nobody else has offered a positive word for his responses in the Q&A. So he creates a false identity to agree with himself. Really quite pitiful.
Terry, I’m sorry, but you’ve completely lost whatever professional integrity you had left.
Not only have you lost the argument, but you’ve embarrassed yourself and your company (if that was even still possible).
morever, dear Grant/Terry , my reference to “Advertising Coordinator” was not a poor level consideration
I repeat that that fucntion underlines, once again, tha fact that BB is an investment since affiliates have to do nothing
do anyone agree with me ?
Why did this man terry stern feel the need to come on this blog as another , how embarrassing is that . He just single handedly demolished any credibility banners broker had
Flipping heck!! 😮 I can’t believe how much ‘verbiage’ has been added to this thread by stern Terry Grant 😉 since I last dropped in. Staggering. Thanks Phil/Della. Yes, I am in BB Phil. But not up to my neck! The money I’ve personally lost is barely the issue. It’s about principles now. I’ve had a few run ins over the years with organised crime i.e. NHS management, Council officials, the local MP…that kind of thing! 😉 I’m the type who turns up at their sham public consultation meetings and makes them wish they’d stayed under wraps! ‘If you can’t beat ’em, beat ’em up’ is my motto! 🙂
The fact that it’s so difficult to find out about these events indicates that BB are trying to draw new blood in selectively via their busiest and most loyal affliates. Getting 10 people to buy top of the range packages is far better for them than getting 100 people to sign up to the $25 dollar job.
Terry Stern is like a Swiss Tony version of a PR management consultant.
Absolute carnage for the silly little man.
Poor guy doesn’t realise he’s being used and will pay a heavy price for involvement in this scam. Contact details all over the internet. Schoolboy errors Terrance! Snigger!
It’s a sad fact but people of limited intellect are often the types that scammers gorge on to grow their scam and grow fat on their stupidity. Unfortunately Terry is one such gimp, who quite clearly tastes of delicious stupidity with a heavy hint of arrogant incompetence that lingers on like a pungent fart.
Kisses Terry. xx
Finch Sells….Can you post the proof that Terry and Casry are the same?
@IRISH#1 For my money you don’t need IP address data from Finchy; here’s proof enough:
Search the thousands of replies to the 3 Banners Broker posts on this blog for the word “asshat”.
Then go to the Realscam forum and search the thousands of posts on the 2 Banners Broker threads there for it.
Guess who the only two posters are to have used ‘asshat’ (other than responders quoting them).
Yep. ‘C. Grant’ on here and ‘tdstern’ on RealScam.
QED.
Poor Terry came here and to RealScam on a mission to put us all straight with his reasoning and public relations finesse, only to end up authoring a most embarrassing public relations omnishambles and acquiring a new soubriquet:
Terry ‘The Asshat’ Stern.
Just in case you need a dictionary definition (and picture) of the term:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=asshat
Well, you people have had some fun. So now I’m Terry Stern am I?
This just shows the level of desperation some of you will go to in order to make yourselves look good.
I rest my case. Everything else but the issues in order to make everyone but yourselves look bad. How are the book sales going Finch? Has all this made your pockets fuller?
No, I’m not Terry Stern, I don’t even live on the same continent as he does, but it does prove my point, that you’re not here to debate the issues, you’re more interested in attacking the company.
You couldn’t debate the facts, so you attack the man stating them. Good job everyone.
By the way, I heard the term “asshat” from the TV show, That 70’s Show. It’s a pretty common term, but I’m guessing you all don’t get out much with all the online investigating you all do on those unscrupulous companies.
C.Grant its alway’s easy to change every few weeks about what the bussines is about isn’t it Terry …. do you realy know what you are talking about ??? first you contacted a blins network and they stated that’s how BBI works true the blind networks but you don’t mention a name so it could be checked now you come here talking that you contacted a white label ad network ofc no name al secret … if i had conatcted a white label ad network i would post its name if i didn’t had any interest in BBI like you claim …. you just googeld finch blog and thought hey they are talking shit about a company i don’t know but i am sure they are wrong lets get into this and then you post the same shit and in the same writing style as Mr Stern … i am 100% this is the blog war Lorenzo was talking about …. like others have said IF BBI would be a legitimate company and this blog was full of crap … they wouldn’t spend their time on this blog they would proove it with a press release and ofc if needed go after these negative bloggers trough a lawsuit …. but nope here you are repeating the same nonsens over and over again … why is BBI not able to pay in time ?? well for me its obvious and nope not due to processing time … its delliberate BBI keeps the payments pending and try to figure out how to manage to pay some … to keep a little bit of credibility …
and same for you you can’t debate the fact’s … and you attack the man in the same way … you come here and say thats the way BBI works and its like that because I SAY SO … som mr no interest in BBI how come that you know all about the companie but you have nothing to do with them rofl … 😉 have a nice day Terry you are a joke of a PR man
kind regards
brenie
To be fair the only person he seems to have annoyed would be the handful who use this blog. Not really an issue, more like a pebble falling into a very large pond. I have never had a payout issue as i read the instructions and guidance that BB provides. The one issue which keeps arising on this blog is that it’s members have not made a quick buck, that’s not what BB is about. I have done my due diligence and i have to be frank about this, the handfull of anti BB sites just appear to be more like a bunch of guys on a shooting range hoping to hit something. It hasn’t happened and nor will it, you should use your time more constructively and try and make something of yourselves instead of being nasty to others.
What is the Top Direct Selling – MLM Company in 2013?
OPN – Sitetalk – SINGAPORE (15%, 10,585 Votes)
Monavie – USA (14%, 10,330 Votes)
Banners Broker – BELIZE (6%, 4,175 Votes)
QNet – HONG KONG (5%, 3,829 Votes)
WorldVentures – USA (4%, 2,896 Votes)
It Works! Global – USA (3%, 2,024 Votes)
Talk Fusion – USA (3%, 1,998 Votes)
Great news for these great companies, keep it up guys.
Awesome post Mark. You’ve just destroyed any argument against anti-BBers with your erudite and well presented post dripping with proven facts and backed up with an in-depth knowledge of, not only the industry, but the BB model also.
Do you have a newsleter I could subscribe to in order to read more of your well researched and fascinating viewpoints?
@Mark … i alway’s love the comments about your scam/ponzi believers … one of those quotes is alway’s make something of yourself … i made more of myslef then you will ever dream of mark 😉 its not because i don’t like BB … i am a looser just joined because a friend asked me and i didn’t do to much DD shit happens 😉 … i read the instructions and guidance or however you want to call it and guess what it doesn’t work … there are loads of people not getting paid but seems you are not willing to see that …. but ofc i know its because they do’nt understand how to withdraw money or they made a mistake it will never be BBI that cant’ pay isn’t it ;-)and its ofc not there fault that payments can pend for months …. hey guy’s dont you know thats how legitimate company’s work rofl …
oohh before i forget wasn’t your PR guru Terry Stern not on this blog telling us BBI is NOT AN MLM COMPANY ??? strange then that you pop up on that pol … rofl
kind regrads
brenie
@ Mark
“Look guys, grow up. This is not a scam and the only people who seem to beleive so are the half a dozen or so who visit this site and realscum.
Get a life whilst we enjoy the high life.”
As C. Grant pointed out to me “the BB website clearly states….
” Typical income of a typical Banners Broker member: USD $567.57/year
*All prices shown in USD currency.” or about $47.30/month.”
Wow, enjoying the high life with an extra $47.30/month. Please, how can I get in on this fantastic opportunity so I can enjoy the high life too!
I’ve been reading this blog for the last week because my friend has invested 3K with BB and has told me his account now stands at 9k in less than three months and he wants me to ‘invest’ as well. At first I thought ‘wow’, how is that even possible? My initial thought was suspicion, but he won’t hear a word against them so I figured, ok, I’ll check them out with an open mind and see where it leads me. I’ve read just about every comment and it has become abundantly clear that people who support BB always come across as arrogant and abusive. Why? Finch may or may not be genuine (althrough my gut says he is) but he always gives reasoned argrument with common sense. And speaking as someone who knows didly squat about advertising, he has made things easy to understand.
So, answer me this, in laymans terms, as I’m open to be converted:
How do you suddenly double, triple etc your money by collecting extra panels in red, blue, purple blah, blah, blah? Where is the extra money coming from to pay a higher rate to ‘affiliates’? Its a gimmick. Why do they need gimmocks if there genuine?It surely can’t make commercial sense to suddenly charge double or triple a fee for adverts, isn’t it cheaper to buy in bulk? You wouldn’t pay 50p for one toilet roll and then say ‘if you buy two together it’ll cost you £3’ I worked in retail for thirty years and earned commission on sales. Margins in retail are cut-throat. If i’d made double or triple commission every time I did ten, twenty,etc sales I’d be a millionaire and my store would have closed. Come to think of it, with the guaranteed returns that BB are promising, why bother in retail/banking/ etc at all. We can all sign up for BB and live in utopia for ever!
Very good post Harrison…although to be fair all round, there has been abuse batted backwards and forwards by supporters and detractors of BB. Not all those who hate BB are necessarily lovely, altruistic people! This place is full of egotists, self-proclaimed experts, dull people, interesting people, ignorant people, blatant liars and so on. I’d call myself an interesting egotist who tells the truth! But then an egotist would wouldn’t he? Even if he is a boring liar! 😉
In the end, all that matters are the FACTS. I don’t really care whether Grant is Stern. It makes no difference. If you cut through the crap on both sides of the fence, it’s easy to see that BB is utterly dependent on signing up people like me and your friend i.e. People who knew/know sod all about affiliate marketing/advertising/profit margins are are easily mislead by a sexy, seductive model. And as red-blooded males, who can blame us! 🙂
BB are not and never have been interested in forming relationships with big business corporations/established advertising networks, or indeed, anyone who they NEED in order for the model as presented, to work. If they were they would be attending the usual trade fairs where such deals are done.
We therefore now KNOW BEYOND DOUBT that the only money providing income to BB is from affiliates purchasing invisible products. It is IMPOSSIBLE for those affilaites to then generate ANY profit for themselves, never mind the exponetial figures that the panels show as ‘earnings’.
What BB can do is keep their leaky boat afloat by allowing affiliates to only draw out their ‘profit’ in long drawn out dribbles such that these theoretical earnings give an illusion of growth and, hopefully for BB, draw new people in on the same wing and a prayer. You may well have signed up on your friend’s advice, and many have signed up on the advice of affiliates who have no idea what REALLY goes on.
Part of the mechanism involves constantly coming up with new excuses as to why payments can’t/won’t be processed which make it seem to be the fault of anyone apart from BB. This creates a situation whereby people driven by the dream of long term riches put up with any amount of excuses and apologies. Others make no withdrawl requests because the plough every penny of ‘earnings’ back into buying more products so that their business looks even more impressive on their computer screens!
Those who have managed their accounts carefully, and made modest requests for modest payments yet haven’t had a penny of it, are the ones who PROVE the case that BB has practically no cashflow. Therefore this PROVES the business is nothing more than ‘Affliate A selling Affliate B the IDEA that they sell the same IDEA to affiliate C and so on….Nothing of value is generated by any of those people because we’re neither advertsisers or publishers or banners dealers. All the money goes to BB and BB decides/manipulates/restricts how that money is distributed, if at all.
It’s not this blog or realscam that is choking the BB dream. It’s the fact that BB have reached critical mass…i.e. a couple of years in they have many 1,000’s of affiliates who think they have generated real profits via a real advertsing network in conjunction with profits accrued from seriously wealthy advertisers.
Now that those affilates want to draw on some of that profit, there is a bottleneck which simply cannot be unplugged because by the time you get to affiliate 300,000, in order to finance even relatively small withdrawls each months, BB would have to be a bigger financial player than the Bank Of England, the FTSE, The Dow Jones and Peter Jones put together!
To quote your good self if I may:
‘At first I thought ‘wow’, how is that even possible? My initial thought was suspicion, but he won’t hear a word against them so I figured, ok, I’ll check them out with an open mind and see where it leads me….’
Well Harrison, it’s lead you here. When I signed up, my feelings were similar to yours. It sounds too good to be true, but no one has a bad word to say about it (and at that time no one had). In fact it was claimed it was impossible not to make money with BB.
So that’s why I signed up then, but if I were you now, I would arrive hear with an open mind and leave with knowledge that itsn’t even possible to get back 1p of your expenditure at this stage of proceedings.
Take heed dear Harrison and consider yourself fortunate to have met an online egotist, albeit a truthful and interesting one! 😉
Hi Harrison, great first post!
You’ve told us why you thought it was a scam, and my experience was similar. I simply couldn’t figure why BB were paying out money to so-called “affiliates” who added no value to BB. If the affiliates were investing money (giving it to BB so that “banners” could be “brokered” and a profit created, such profit being split between BB and affiliates) then I could understand it.
But BB have always denied being an investment vehicle. Even if they were lying and they DID use affiliate money to buy and sell, that still wouldn’t explain matters — because the rate of return promised to affiliates was always far greater than could be made in the online advertising industry, which is VERY competitive.
The only explanation left (as to why BB needed affiliates) was that BB is a ponzi. There is simply no credible alternative.
Thankfully, I haven’t invested a penny. (Still ready to be convinced through, but not looking good!) It’s my friends blind faith in them that actually made me doubt my initial suspicions and planted an element of ‘it could be true’ after all? So I delved a bit deeper. I asked him how much his account was worth? 9k. I asked him how much money he had actually withdrawn? None, he replied. Why would he be so stupid as to withdraw money when the screen was telling him his money was growing at an alarming rate and would continue to grow. He had done his research and was sitting pretty with an estimated guaranteed return of 20k in about six months time. All for doing nothing but watch the numbers grow on a computer screen. So, I asked him, if he closed his account TODAY, how much money would he ACTUALLY make. Well, er, he said, it doesn’t quite work out like that. He wouldn’t get 9k back.You have to keep your money in, or it won’t ‘grow’. Blind faith clouds all reason and normal judgement I fear. But that is how people are being sucked in isn’t it? Quite clever actually, scarily so.
The latest LIE from BB:
‘… we are happy to say that EVERYONE who made a request by December 5th, 2012 using STP was paid by Christmas.’
I KNOW for a FACT that is utter shit. My STP request was made long before then! It was ‘reversed’ i.e. cancelled by BB for no good reason. They falsely blamed STP! I resubmitted the request some time in November and it is still ‘pending’. So when they say ‘EVERYONE’ they must be lying!
I submitted support tickets over several weeks which went unresolved or unanswered and have since been purged. Two that were supposed to be ‘escalated’ to management just disappeared off the system without trace!
The support ticket submition process has been suspended completely over this weekend. Again, no reason given.
This is the sort of shit that BB put their affiliates through day after day month after month, whilst promoting an official line (aka pack of lies) that everyone who is owed money has been paid.
Your friend’s account is worthless Harrison. Don’t bother telling him though because he won’t want to know that he’s lost three grand and will take significant umbrage at the suggestion he’s been mugged. He’ll find out soon enough for himself.
Really sorry to hear that D. Hope your ‘investment’ isn’t to high and you aren’t going to lose to much? And your right, he isn’t interested in the ‘it’s a scam line’. I posted a really good scam video clip on his facebook wall and he promptly deleted it! Told me in no uncertain terms not to do that again. I’ve also told him about this blog so he can read all of these comments for himself and defend BB to the hilt if he believes in them so much. Nothing yet.
I absolutely believe you haven’t been paid, for whatever reason, but am still trying hard to stay on the fence out of respect for a valued friend.
But…so hard to do. I’ve been reading so much lately and as I’m really naive about websites/advertising etc I’d like to think I can be un-biased in my observations so here goes:
There are hundreds of thousands of websites around. Some are more popular than others. If I were an advertiser I would want my products on a popular site with masses of traffic and would expect to pay a premium for doing so. So surely some ‘banners’ have more potential than others? Who owns these banners? They would surely be of immense value, so why would they require a ‘broker’ to help fill them? Advertisers would surely be falling over themselves to fill these spaces?
If BB were saying…’were renting the banner spaces that no one else wants to advertise on, in the vain hope that in the future there traffic will increase and make you a tidy profit’…I could get on board with that.
Companies grow, thats how stocks and shares work isn’t it? A risk, a gamble? LONG TERM STEADY GROWTH.
But that’s not what there saying is it? Can’t recall all the babble on the video…zzzz but as I understand it, you buy panels that mature in a set time and you double/triple etc your income. I ask again, HOW is this possible if you don’t know whether your banner will be profitable or not? Where does the money come from to pay this bonus if no-one ever visits the site where your banner is? Unless you get lucky and your banner happens to be on the next ‘walmart’ site or whatever.
I’m falling off the fence my friend…into a nasty mess I fear.
What does “generating traffic” or “traffic boosting” actually means? It’s one of those easily used terms in the BB-concept that I can’t visualize. Traffic is generated by real persons visiting a specific web page, isn’t it? If so, how can I make a web page that is on average visited by 100 persons a day, suddenly have it visited by 1000 persons a day?
Grandao – that’s what I have always wondered.
As I understand it, that’s why you have to buy these “traffic packs”; which seem to be you paying yourself to generate fake hits on your website. And that seems plain daft to me. Not to mention dishonest. As soon as I heard this, it raised great doubts in my mind; and I am a person who does not know much about online advertising (although I know more now than I first did). But this to me did not make sense.
If these banners are so fantastic and placed so well on great sites, why do you need to fake the traffic to them?
I am sure that, if I am wrong, someone will correct me.
Another cracking day with bb, more panels capping overnight.
So Della, is it like I’m having an art gallery, trying to sell paintings but having only 100 people visiting my shop, buying some advertising space at BB and rather than having 900 potential buyers looking at my advertisement, BB is sending 900 blind people to my art gallery? I mean, from an advertiser’s point of view I’m just sponsoring BB as I don’t get potential buyers in my shop but only 900 non-potential blind visitors?
Oh, Grandao, I am not the person to ask! I simply don’t know. Your analogy might be right, or it might be that rather than you actually having 900 extra visitors, you say you have them.
Now, Mark, you seem to be very happy with BB, since you have come here especially to say that you have had another “cracking day” with BB, you seem to be a man in the know, so perhaps you can explain the traffic packs and traffic issues to me and Grandao here?
While you are at it, perhaps you can clarify what is meant by panels “capping” and also “qualifying” – makes them sound like they’ve gone out and got 2 GCSEs!*
Many thanks.
*(For non UK readers, a GCSE is an examination taken by young people aged 15/16)
I’d like to know that one to. Surely traffic is simply people who visit your site? How can you buy ‘people’ and make them visit?
Don’t forget the blind network. Mark please tell me how that works. Thanks.
Bingo guys! Now you are asking the right questions 🙂
Harrison: Technically you can buy traffic to a site. There are companies who provide this service. Just like you can buy ‘likes’ for a facebook page or followers on twitter.
The issue is, when you buy traffic, it is not real customers. It is a once off. It is artificial traffic. There is no value added.
A company may use the service once because of the hit stats but will not use again when they see that all those hits are not real customers.
Hence, BB is not a lasting business model.
There are a few people saying that Banners Broker is legitimate all of which appear to be involved and want to believe it is real and dreams can come true.
The arguments against Banners Broker are compelling. It is very hard to believe that a business model with all the stated flaws could possibly be true.
My question is, can the business model be made legitimate?
…I had no idea you could ‘buy’ likes on facebook or twitter. How is that even legal? It could surely give your business a false advantage. This is all getting murkier by the min. Seems a bit dodgy to me. Please explain ‘technically buy’ insider, don’t get it….thanks.
It probably couldnt be made into a legitimate business as it would mean that it would have to go into direct competition with the other brokers.
If this happened they would not be able to compete as they would not have the same buying power. Add to this the fact that the management have no idea of the online advertising industry and have very murky backgrounds.
As can be vouched for by me and other affiliates, the support is terrible and the PR for the ‘company’ is laughable.
Harrison: To take the facebook example, you can buy likes for a facebook page.It may cost something like 25 dollars for 1,000 likes.
These can be used in the hope that it will kick start an interest in your page. Of course, this will only be an initial draw. If there is nothing there to like it means people may visit once but won’t return. Makes sense?
If another broker were to allow affiliates to enter the business in the way Banners Broker claimed they were doing, would not be advantageous for both the broker and the affiliate?
Maybe I am being silly as I do not understand completely what is implied by BB but if there is a way to make this into something truly successful then that would be a great light at the end of the murky tunnel!
Thats the great mystery of BB…lol. They make it as difficult as possible to understand. Honestly, they go on about this great algorithm that gives BB an advantage over the other brokers. There is no advantage.
The profits come from the new affiliates joining. Without these affiliates there is no profits. Its a simple cycler. A gambling game. I’m playing them for years. This one is just slightly better disguised.
BB has nothing to do with advertising. you have to get that out of your head. Its a cycler.
@BBinsider
” the management have no idea of the online advertising industry and have very murky backgrounds.”
The only experience and background BB owners have are failed MLM schemes. Failed in the sense that the majority of the members/investors/affiliates they had lost money. The owners and those who got in initially were very successful albeit not by earning it from a business but by stealing money from those in their downline.
That is why they start a new one up every few years. After 2-3 years there are too many members looking for a payback and there aren’t enough new sign-ups to pay the existing members. Now if they actually had a product they were selling and making money they wouldn’t have to rely on new sign-ups.
Does Google hire more “staff” to pay their current staff? Or do they sell more product to pay their current staff.
Thats what I am saying Ken.
And I agree with you BBinsider 110%.
“Does Google hire more “staff” to pay their current staff? Or do they sell more product to pay their current staff.”
This bears repeating over and over to BB affiliates until they get the message.
BBinsider, how is traffic generating actually done? I know that it can be bought as BB is offering it, but what should I picture in my mind? A nerdic IT-scripter? A Bangalore call center filled with off-shored web site clickers?
Della Cate
Why 2 x GCSEs. As for traffic, this is as a result of people visiting sites. Simple enough for you?
Sorry to be a drive-by poster but wanted to let you guys know that much of the “paid for” traffic is generated by bots. The bot also generates multiple IP addresses so the traffic appears to be legit. No human actually visits the website(s).
It is pointless and no sales are ever forthcoming.
Your full of crap, Banner Broker have reopened the office in India, I am from Ireland and have read all that rubbish you have posted. If your not in Banners Broker you will not understand how it works. Banners Broker works for advertising Brokers online, its never been done before. Hitting three years in bunniss and in over 100 countries worldwide. If it was a scam it be shut down already. Do your homework !! learn how brokers make revenue online and you will understand how Banners Broker works. Don’t deleted this comment !! as other blog’s do!!!
Mark: You have a very innocent view of how traffic is generated.
Thanx for clearing that up, Sue. So when I’m an advertiser who’s buying ad space from BB, BB will generate traffic to ‘cap’ a panel, but in reallife nobody is watching my advertisement, the result for my business is zero. Now how is that explained to be a legit business?
@Brian
Can you explain to all of us who are “full of crap” how BB actually works? You seem to be the expert, would you be willing to answer some questions I have?
Thanks in advance.
@ Grandão
I’m not saying BB use bots, I don’t know if they do or if they don’t.
All the “buy traffic” crap you see all over the web generally use bots, all you are buying is hits to your site. Might be good enough if hits are all you need but for marketing purposes it is pointless. Blackhat stuff will likely get sites blacklisted by the search engines, not recommended.
I was merely pointing out what you get for your “buy traffic” buck. 🙂
Sue
you contradict yourself. you clearly stated that BB use bots, then in your new post you start by saying otherwise only to finish with a BB use bots line. Sort of sums up the depth of thought on this site.
Mark – can you answer my question about how the blind network operates please. I really would like to know. Don’t get distracted by drive-by posters.
I am sure that you have read through the rest of this thread and have seen the replies from Terry Stern in all his aliases, as well as those from people who work in the online advertising business. But I’m always happy to hear from someone who is actually in BB who can articulate clearly on how this all works.
Thank you.
DD
@ Mark. Actually I was replying to a post by Grandão who had visions of people in call centres clicking thousands of ads to generate traffic. It wasn’t BB specific, just a fact about how “paid traffic” is usually generated.
Now are you ready to answer my questions?
@ Ditto Ditto. Rather a nasty comment, I presume you are referring to me.
I might be a new poster on this blog but I can assure you I have read every word of Finch’s blog as well as the BB thread at the RS board. I don’t post at RS but I am known to the Admins and the majority of the scambusters there who, like me, have been in “this game” for more than a couple of minutes.
Mark, do you have any experience of the online advertising world?
It seems to me that the only people who understand how BB works are the people who are in it. The rest of you understand how it doesn’t work! And then there are poor souls like me, who desparately want to believe that it really is as good as BB says it is, but know in there heart of hearts that it really is a complete sham…
So how long will it continue? The posts on RS have been saying for months that it is nearly over, but still it goes on. Does anyone know the rate that BB are signing people up? Is it consistent? If it is, then in theory it will just keep going surely? New money will keep feeding the frenzy and that will in turn keep generating new money?
How do these schemes usually finish? Just disappear? Accounts closed? Or do the authorities get involved and close them down?…
Sue, forgive my ignorance, but what is a bot?
@HARRISON. Ah, bots. They are web robots, software applications that can perform repetitive tasks much faster than humans can.
Nothing wrong with them, Google use them to crawl webpages so they can rank them, as do Yahoo and all the other search engines. There’s also bots that can bet and lay at Betfair (and similar sites) much faster than humans could do.
On a darker side, there’s spambots that add unwanted malware (usually ads) on websites without the owners permission and botnets that are responsible for DDoS attacks and votebots that cast votes on blogs or on YouTube. To be honest there’s 100’s including the ones that send traffic to websites.
Usually when you buy cheap traffic to promote a site that is all you are getting, 1000’s of hits in a short time with no human ever visiting the sites.
I am not in any way saying BB use bots, just that traffic isn’t always about actual people visiting websites and taking a look around in the hope of finding something they want to buy.
The problem I have with BB is how it’s evolved from a HYIP type cycler where online players know (or quickly learn) that the ones at the top get paid from new money coming in. Once the money stops coming in, the thing stops paying and a big proportion lose their money. It’s how cyclers work.
BB on the other hand tweaked it and took it into the real world with meetings and started to attract people in who have probably never heard of HYIPs and such. These people have been brainwashed with so much BS that even the bullshitters themselves believe the crap they are spouting.
When things become “real” there is little chance of it just fading away. BB could roll on for months or even years depending on how much faith the affiliates/investors have in the program and how easy they are persuaded to watch the numbers on the screen rather than withdraw their money. I would say there’s 1000’s who are doing that. Of course, while they are doing that, BB doesn’t have to pay them anything.
Once they start trying to withdraw their money en mass, that’s when this will go belly up.
BB does not have a product, it has nothing to sell to generate income.
We have no way of knowing how long it can continue. Only the BB top jocks know that. I’m not talking about the likes of Terry or Smith. I’m talking right at the top.
Regarding people saying it is already dead. In one way it is. It really depends on your definition.
To the casual observer it looks like it is still alive. They are still recruiting, the website is still running, there are still the seminars.
To the ‘trained’ ponzi player like myself(maybe experienced is a better word), this is dead. The payments have stopped. Of course they are paying a few well positioned shills who they know will shout from the rooftops and bring in a few more suckers, but it is dead. Make no bones about it. Those who join at this stage have no hope of getting their money back.
Take it from me. I have been in more than a year. I have also recruited 2 people(not much but still, it all counts). I can no longer get paid. I have kept all the rules and done exactly as directed. And still n payments. I’m doing this long enough to know when its over.
Do yourself a favour. Take the free advice. You’ll save yourself.
(and before some dopey shill attacks me, just remember by admitting this is over will actually cost me)
@ Brian
“Hitting three years in bunniss and in over 100 countries worldwide. If it was a scam it be shut down already. Do your homework !! learn how brokers make revenue online and you will understand how Banners Broker works. ”
Just because you have a scheme in a 100 countries doesn’t mean it’s not a scam. It usually takes a few years before the authorities get to them to shut them down. The owners of these scams know that and that is why they shut them down after 2-3 years themselves and start up another one.
Brian, I have done my homework and understand what BB is telling you.They are the last ones to tell you the truth. In fact their business model requires them not to but to give you a complex plan, difficult to understand by anyone unless they do their homework. Now I suggest you do your homework and learn how the owners of BB and their top executives work and you will see them for what they are and have been for many years.
Do you honestly think BB is going to tell you how they earn their revenue? How many people do you think they would sign up if they told them they were running a Ponzi scheme?
How long would BB last if no new members were to enrol? A sound profitable business will survive without adding more staff. A sound business hires more staff only after the volume of sales exceeds what the staff can handle. BB does it in reverse as it needs the money from what the new sign-ups pay to pay the current affiliates.
@Sue.
Yeh, I’m one of those muppets that doesn’t know what HYIP stands for, let alone is! Would prob have joined my friend to, if it wasn’t for this site…
@Sue: Suppose BB is not using bots/scripts to generate traffic, what other options are there?
Sue
Lol, why would i answer any of your questions,who are you?
Good news though, my first withdrawl went through so of to the pub today.
Panels capping overnight, great times with BB, or you can just be ignorant and claim it’s a scam….
Mark, sweetheart, I do know what traffic is. What I asked about, and what you have not yet explained, is BBs Traffic PACKS.
However, Sue has kindly explained about bots. It sounds to me as if BB may use these, but of course we don’t know for sure. What I think we can reasonably assume, in the want of other evidence, is that it is as I said; you are paying yourself to generate fake traffic to a site. Please note the use of the word “paying”. It seems to me to be just another device to pump money into BB.
As for panels “capping” and “qualifying”, I will seek an explanation elsewhere from someone who does know.
The problem that BB has is that people who do not join it are NOT ignorant. They are the ones who are asking the difficult questions and seeking the elusive information. They are the ones who are putting BB under the spotlight of their own common sense – and now some people who have joined (possibly regretting it) are starting to do this too – and finding that things do not add up and do not make sense. They are the ones who are making noise about it.
@Sue:
It was not meant as a dig at you at all and I apologise if that is how it appeared. I was simply trying to get Mark to focus on answering my question which he was avoiding, continues to avoid and probably can’t answer.
DD
Another way to get “fake traffic” is to use PTC sites.Basically you pay real people to go to your site. Be in mind though , this traffic will only keep up as long as you pay. However, they served a completely different niche and purpose rather than creating sales.As such,paying to click on ads on your website is considered to be click fraud by the PTC providers(which is against their terms) and will usually result in your account being blocked or banned.
Guys, what makes you think there is ANY traffic at all? Let alone bots (or even PPV)? Because BBs control panel shows numbers moving upwards? That doesn’t mean anything.
If they are actually placing ads on sites (which they would control or really really crap traffic) and buying fake traffic then it would only be recently. And if that is the case its only trying to get them off the hook in a criminal case where they could prove that there was actual banner purchase, albeit junk placements and selling on at HUGELY inflated prices. Also there may be traffic now, but it will be useless junk fake or redirect traffic that is worth nothing (and consequently costs nothing).
The only thing they won’t be able to explain in a court of law is where the profit they were going to pay everyone has disappeared to.
Mark: when did you make the withdrawal request?
Actually Mark, don’t bother answering that. On the 8th of Feb at 8:49 you said the following:
‘I have never had a payout issue as i read the instructions and guidance that BB provides.’
Now today you are claiming that your first withdrawal went through today.
Another liar. Really getting tired of this.
No wonder you think BB is real if you think a lie that stupid is going to fool people.
What a clown.
rofl whas thinking just the same this Mark said he never had withdrawal problems and now he claims he has done his first one …. do they actualy think before they post i wonder … and did you got paid or you just requested a withdrawal mark ??? if requested enjoy the pending time its not 15 calendar day’s like they promise 😉
kind regards
brenie
It doesn’t matter now if he claims he was paid, made the withdrawal or anything else. His credibility is shot by being exposed as a liar so he brings nothing to the table.
Some people think they are helping BB by telling lies but due to their ineptitude they are actually doing more harm!
Its like back when people were claiming that mastercard were endorsing BB. My upline told me at the time that caused serious issues for BB and nearly brought it down. All because of idiots telling lies.
@BBinsider Were they idiots telling lies or were they people who thought they were telling the truth? Not everyone caught up in this are experts in playing the game. You can see that from Mark’s little foray on here.
BBinsider it was BB that were pushing that MasterCard line. Oh also saying that the fact that they were “allowed” to do business in a load of countries also added to their credibility.
People who don’t know what they are talking about should just stay quiet. Otherwise they end up looking stupid.
Not sure about the mastercard line. I really do think it was affiliates that pushed that one. I would agree though that BB didn’t try to stop it. It backfired though.
The real world and cyclers do not mix well. People shouldn’t try to make them. This is when people get burned.
I do think BB are allowed to do business in a load of countries. I don’t know what that proves or disproves.
It proves nothing. New companies are not researched and vetted and then “allowed” to do business or not.
Exactly
@ Nick
“Guys, what makes you think there is ANY traffic at all? Let alone bots (or even PPV)? Because BBs control panel shows numbers moving upwards? That doesn’t mean anything.”
That is what I’ve been saying. What they have is a sophisticated software program that leads the affiliates to believe they are filling up panels or whatever and earning money on a gazillion impressions. Of course BB will never disclose how much revenue is actually earned from traffic. They will claim that they earn revenue by selling traffic packs which is the same, however, the traffic packs are sold to their own affiliates and that is where it ends. BB has the money and the affiliate has what? Nothing, Just because BB says he purchased impressions doesn’t mean there are any.
It’s the same as in Raj’s previous scam he was involved in, selling non-existant ICF homes. Actually members purchased ICF blocks and based on the number of people members enrolled would eventually have enough blocks to build a home. Of course the company didn’t have any blocks for you to purchase. Can you imagine if 200,000 members worldwide were to request the actual blocks being delivered how much money that would have cost the company?
BB selling panels is actually quite clever in that it is not a physical object. Their sales pitch is intriguing and people in MLM are used to the “doubling your money” for no work schemes and keep hoping that the next one will be the one that will finally let them live the “high life”. Unfortunately it is always the same, the ones who get in early that do very well and the rest may get their initial investment back but more than likely lose the majority of it.
BB affiliates need to ask for proof of what they are buying actually exists. Just because they say so and show them a BB chart which says they purchased impressions is not proof of any ads sites with the impressions. Showing colourful panels moving and changing colours is not proof of anything other than they have good programmers.
From Dave Osman, BB shill on Talkgold.com
“wow what can i say.We have had a fantastic European Convention in Portugal.Chris Smith pushed a button on his phone and said the engine is now live and before we could get back to our rooms we had panels capping all over the place and got up this morning to find even more had capped.”
Sorry, isn’t the panels capping related to completed campaigns, how can they be capped by someone pressing a button on their phone?
More to the point, how can anyone be so gullible to believe it to be the way the industry works?
Theseus – it’s obvious.
Chris Smith is Superman in disguise. That’s why no-one can find his back story or anything about him.
By day, normal, mild mannered IT and Maths genius who just wants to give the little guy a chance; but once he gets a phone in his hand with a button to push, well, watch out world! Those panels will be capping like there’s no tomorrow!
(Note: I may be being just a tad sarcastic here.)
Hi all,
I have read through the entrie posts, and i just wanted to change the prospective a little, and perhaps focus on those people who have already joined BB and wondererd just what others are thinking after reading it all that above?
because reading through it all, i felt really concerned about even joining BB.
And, as the comments above suggest, when you visit the web site of BB it persents the story that it is an advetising company selling advertising for profit just like Google does, but shares 50% of the revenue with its affilites. simple you think?
so over all there are some very valid points to concider, and i for one thank the people that took the time to write them, the conclusion i draw to most of the comments raised, is that they seem to suggest the program is about to turn south
Well that may or may not be the case, whilst it is usefull to see the comments, i personally am not interested in the poltics of them.
so below i wanted to share an HONEST USER EXPERIENCE.
As a standard member of BB, i thought it might be usefull for some people to know, how in my own experiance, since joining BB back in August 2012 is going, and to also repeort what happens going forward.
As i said above i joined BB in August 2012, with the enteprise package, the only package i have ever bought, plus one traffic pack at $50 which gave me 100.000 traffic hits.
so as most people will realise you have to buy 1 traffic pack per month, and $15.00 a month membership.
I have let it run on its own ever since, and have not bothered to refer any one, so my point is for the benifit of those that have joined recently, to tell them what has actually happens when you are five months in. and are in it by yourself, with no referals.
As the panels roll over at 100% in the first round. and 50% in the second round, with the complimentry traffic given to the panels by BB, all is fine, and the traffic builds up, by the next month When you get to the third round and then the forth round your panels have increased, in order to qualify them all you actually end up having to increase your traffic subscription.
the down side is that, if you do increase that traffic subscription, you have to pay it each mounth, and if you attampt to reduce it there are consiquences, you account can be frozen for up to 6 months.
i found that 4 months in, i needed 3 traffic packs to qualify most of the panels
And i made a commitment to an extra 2 traffic pack per month, However the extra two traffic packs i now have to buy each month are some two and a half weeks apart, from my first monthly traffic pack.
so this delays the qualifying of panels, when you need to set your green ones going again. as these have a 3 month avarage runtime, you loose valuable time waiting for traffic packs, or you make the mistake of buying more traffic pack than you would pehaps need for the next three months or so while your panels are running.
i have not done any figures so i cannot report if this would be a loss, but, it most certainly reduces the amount you can keep in you ewallet.
Talking of ewallets, i have reached a point where i am able to withdraw money to the BB Card (vector card) and i will wait now to see if all the comments about people not getting their withdarawal are true or not, only time will tell i suppose, but one thing is sure, i am not putting any more in.
Thanks for reading this, i will post again should i ever get a withdrawal and real cash in the hand through the BB Card ATM.
Ta
@Ras,
Great post..will look forward to reading more. Had no idea you HAVE to buy a pack every month. How much does this cost you?
Dear Ras
Thank you for your post. It is interesting to hear your experiences. Please do keep us informed.
Kind regards
@Ras
So your initial “investment” in August was $1225.00 plus $50 + $15 for a total of $1290.00 In the next 3 months you paid another$50/m for a total of $1440+$45 (admin) =$1,485.00 Since Dec.you added another 2 traffic pacs a month for a total of $150 +15 =$165/m. So by the end of Feb. you have now invested a total of $1,980.00 in BB. You are now at the stage of being able to withdraw some money (up to 50%) which by the way will cost you 5%.
BB has 3 sources of revenue:
1. New sign-ups
2. Sales of traffic packs to its affiliates
3. Monthly Admin fees from its affiliates
4. Service fees for funding / withdrawing from your eWallet.
The only sales BB has are to its own members.
Ras I hope you get your investment back, but if you do it will only be because someone else got convinced to join and at this late stage of BB’s life will probably lose his “investment”.
you only can make your investement back if you have sign ups …. you can’t activate your panels otherwise because on top of your TP you need allowance and the only way to get it is having a downline, you get 50% allowance of the panel they activate … so lets say they activate a yellow panel thats 5000 allowance then you get 2500 allowance so at least you need to have 2 or more peeps in your downline with the same pack …. if you dont sign anyone up the only way is to roll up your pannels and doing that NO way you will make your money back …. it takes far too long for you’r panels to cap and monthly traffick pack and account fee will kill you and eventualy you will you go in minus and then they don’t pay out …. there payment method’s and logic are hillarious … lets say you have 550 in your ewallet to withdrawl and you withdraw 500 …. you will be on 50 in your ewallet they take the 500 straight out even if its pending …. knowing the time it takes BB to pay out ( for ever ):D and in the meanwile your automated TP purchase hits your ewallet +1 TP = -50$ and your standard member fee -15$ will end up at -15 in your ewallet they will not pay your 500 as long as you are in minus sounds logic doesn’t it 😀
kind regards
brenie
Brenie…. are you a member of BB? Because you clearly do not know what you’re babbling about. The only way you will not make enough money to cover your initial investment is to completely mismanage your account. You DO NOT need referrals to build this business. The only referral I have is my wife and that was AFTER I withdrew my initial funding. So stop talking shit and at least be honest whether you believe BB is legit or not. If you think it’s not, then bring some real facts to the table, not fabrications or speculations.
BB announces new [soon to be compulsory]$500 monthly upgrade plus a new $7k executive panel to its members launching feb 19th thus generating huge income for 2013.Fast forward video about15 mins to hear Chris Smith breaking news https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=dZE-91IP2jg
‘@BBinsider Were they idiots telling lies or were they people who thought they were telling the truth? Not everyone caught up in this are experts in playing the game. You can see that from Mark’s little foray on here.’
I disagree with you here Ditto. Mark never thought he was telling the truth. One day hw claims he has had no problem getting his payments, than two days later he informs us that he is getting his first payment.
Thats not, not knowing. Its just plain lying.
@Nick
Just trying to get the BB business model clear for my own understanding. As the traffic packages are obligatory each month within BB, I was wondering what these packages exactly are. How is BB explaining the need of traffic boost packages? In a real model the capping speed of panels of the same colour could diver from panel to panel, depending on the website that is offering ad space. Some web sites have a lot of visitors, others have only few. Nevertheless in BB all panels of a certain colour do need more or less the same amount of time to ‘cap’… I assume that advertisers are not paying for a bot to hit some pages, but are expecting real people seeing their ad. But I might be naive…
There is no traffic. You are over complicating things.
@Grandão. Sorry if I confused you with talk of bots, etc. I was merely trying to explain that internet “traffic” doesn’t have to mean humans visiting websites.
It’s a moot point with BB, there are no ads, there is no traffic and the only reason they need affiliates is to supply the money.
It’s an elaborate scam, nothing more.
Yes, as above these panels and colours are just made up bullshit by Banners Broker, they have no bearing on anything. It sounds so stupid to people in the business.
If you guys want to hear something funny just search the following on Google:-
“joe duffy” “banners broker” podcast
All those terms together with the speech markets on one search box on Google. Click on the first result and then look down the page for Banners Broker and click on the link to download the podcast and listen to it once its downloaded.
It’s pretty long (around an hour) but is absolutely hilarious to listen to. It’s the bloke Paul McCarthy being ripped apart by an excellent Irish radio host, who pretty much hits the nail on the head.